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Goner Message Board / ???? / The 50 albums that changed music
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 1:19 am
 
Yes, some of you have figured me out...I am writing something and using you guys as guinea pigs...

Sunday July 16, 2006
The Observer

1 The Velvet Underground and Nico
The Velvet Underground and Nico (1967)

Though it sold poorly on its initial release, this has since become arguably the most influential rock album of all time. The first art-rock album, it merges dreamy, druggy balladry ('Sunday Morning') with raw and uncompromising sonic experimentation ('Venus in Furs'), and is famously clothed in that Andy Warhol-designed 'banana' sleeve. Lou Reed's lyrics depicted a Warholian New York demi-monde where hard drugs and sexual experimentation held sway. Shocking then, and still utterly transfixing.

Without this, there'd be no ... Bowie, Roxy Music, Siouxsie and the Banshees and the Jesus and Mary Chain, among many others.
SOH

2 The Beatles
Sgt Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band (1967)

There are those who rate Revolver (1966) or 'the White Album' (1968) higher. But Sgt Pepper's made the watertight case for pop music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers. At a time when all pop music was stringently manufactured, these Paul McCartney-driven melodies and George Martin-produced whorls of sound proved that untried ground was not only the most fertile stuff, but also the most viable commercially. It defined the Sixties and - for good and ill - gave white rock all its airs and graces.

Without this ... pop would be a very different beast.
KE

3 Kraftwerk
Trans-Europe Express (1977)

Released at the height of punk, this sleek, urbane, synthesised, intellectual work shared little ground with its contemporaries. Not that it wanted to. Kraftwerk operated from within a bubble of equipment and ideas which owed more to science and philosophy than mere entertainment. Still, this paean to the beauty of mechanised movement and European civilisation was a moving and exquisite album in itself. And, through a sample on Afrika Bambaataa's seminal 'Planet Rock', the German eggheads joined the dots with black American electro, giving rise to entire new genres.

Without this... no techno, no house, no Pet Shop Boys. The list is endless.
KE

4 NWA
Straight Outta Compton (1989)

Like a darker, more vengeful Public Enemy, NWA (Niggaz With Attitude) exposed the vicious realities of the West Coast gang culture on their lurid, fluent debut. Part aural reportage (sirens, gunshots, police radio), part thuggish swagger, Compton laid the blueprint for the most successful musical genre of the last 20 years, gangsta rap. It gave the world a new production mogul in Dr Dre, and gave voice to the frustrations that flared up into the LA riots in 1992. As befits an album boasting a song called 'Fuck tha Police', attention from the FBI, the Parents' Music Resource Centre and our own Metropolitan Police's Obscene Publications Squad sealed its notoriety.

Without this ... no Eminem, no 50 Cent, no Dizzee Rascal.
KE

5 Robert Johnson
King of the Delta Blues Singers (1961)

Described by Eric Clapton as 'the most important blues singer that ever lived', Johnson was an intensely private man, whose short life and mysterious death created an enduring mythology. He was said to have sold his soul to the devil at a crossroads in Mississippi in exchange for his finger-picking prowess. Johnson recorded a mere 29 songs, chief among them 'Hellhound on My Trail', but when it was finally issued, King of the Delta Blues Singers became one of the touchstones of the British blues scene.

Without this ... no Rolling Stones, Cream, Led Zeppelin.
SOH

6 Marvin Gaye
What's Going On (1971)

Gaye's career as tuxedo-clad heart-throb gave no hint he would cut a concept album dealing with civil rights, the Vietnam war and ghetto life. Equally startling was the music, softening and double-tracking Gaye's falsetto against a wash of bubbling percussion, swaying strings and chattering guitars. Motown boss Berry Gordy hated it but its disillusioned nobility caught the public mood. Led by the oft-covered 'Inner City Blues', it ushered in an era of socially aware soul.

Without this ... no Innervisions (Stevie Wonder) or Superfly (Curtis Mayfield).
NS

7 Patti Smith
Horses (1975)

Who would have thought punk rock was, in part, kickstarted by a girl? Poet, misfit and New York ligger, Patti channelled the spirits of Keith Richards, Bob Dylan and Rimbaud into female form, and onto an album whose febrile energy and Dionysian spirit helped light the touchpaper for New York punk. The Robert Mapplethorpe-shot cover, in which a hungry, mannish Patti stares down the viewer, defiantly broke with the music industry's treatment of women artists (sexy or girl-next-door) and still startles today.

Without this ... no REM, PJ Harvey, Razorlight. And no powerful female pop icons like Madonna.
KE

8 Bob Dylan
Bringing it All Back Home (1965)

The first folk-rock album? Maybe. Certainly the first augury of what was to come with the momentous 'Like a Rolling Stone'. Released in one of pop's pivotal years, Bringing it All Back Home fused hallucinatory lyricism and, on half of its tracks, a raw, ragged rock'n'roll thrust. On the opening song, 'Subterranean Homesick Blues', Dylan manages to pay homage to the Beats and Chuck Berry, while anticipating the surreal wordplay of rap.

Without this ... put simply, on this album and the follow-up, Highway 61 Revisited, Dylan invented modern rock music.
SOH

9 Elvis Presley
Elvis Presley (1956)

The King's first album was also the first example of how to cash in on a teenage craze. With Presleymania at full tilt, RCA simultaneously released a single, a four-track EP and an album, all with the same cover of Elvis in full, demented cry. They got their first million dollar album, the fans got a mix of rock-outs like 'Blue Suede Shoes', lascivious R&B and syrupy ballads.

Without this ... no King, no rock and roll madness, no Beatles first album, no pop sex symbols.
NS

10 The Beach Boys
Pet Sounds (1966)

Of late, Pet Sounds has replaced Sgt Pepper's as the critics' choice of Greatest Album of All Time. Composed by the increasingly reclusive Brian Wilson while the rest of the group were touring, it might well have been a solo album. The beauty resides not just in its compositional genius and instrumental invention, but in the elaborate vocal harmonies that imbue these sad songs with an almost heartbreaking grandeur.

Without this ... where to start? The Beatles acknowledged its influence; Dylan said of Brian Wilson, 'That ear! I mean, Jesus, he's got to will that to the Smithsonian.'
SOH

11 David Bowie
The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders From Mars (1972)

Bowie's revolutionary mix of hard rock and glam pop was given an otherwordly look and feel by his coquettish alter ego Ziggy. It's not so much that every act that followed dyed their hair orange in homage to the spidery spaceman; more that they learned the value of creating a 'bubble' of image and presentation that fans could fall in love with.

Without this ... we'd be lost. No Sex Pistols, no Prince, no Madonna, no Duran Duran, no Boy George, no Kiss, no Bon Jovi, no 'Bohemian Rhapsody' ... I could go on.
LH

12 Miles Davis
Kind of Blue (1959)

A rare example of revolutionary music that almost everyone liked from the moment they heard it. Its cool, spacey, open-textured approach marked a complete break with the prevalent 'hard bop' style. The effect, based on simple scales, called modes, was fresh, delicate, approachable but surprisingly expressive. Others picked up on it and 'modal jazz' has been part of the language ever since. The album also became the media's favourite source of mood music.

Without this ... no ominous, brooding, atmospheric trumpet behind a million radio plays and TV documentaries.
DG

13 Frank Sinatra
Songs for Swingin' Lovers (1956)

The previous year Sinatra had cut In the Wee Small Hours, a brooding cycle of torch songs that was arguably pop's first concept album. Once again working with arranger Nelson Riddle, he presented its complement; a set of upbeat paeans to romance. Exhilarating performances of standards like 'I've Got You Under My Skin' defined Sinatra's urbane, finger-snapping persona for the rest of his career and pushed the record to number one in the first ever British album chart.

Without this ... the 'singer as song interpreter' wouldn't have been born, karaoke menus would be much diminished.
NS

14 Joni Mitchell
Blue (1971)

Though Carole King's Tapestry was the biggest-selling album of the era, it is Joni Mitchell's Blue that remains the most influential of all the early Seventies outings by confessional singer-songwriters. Joni laid bare her heart in a series of intimate songs about love, betrayal and emotional insecurity. It could have been hell (think James Taylor) but for the penetrating brilliance of the songwriting. Raw, spare and sophisticated, it remains the template for a certain kind of baroque female angst.

Without this ... no Tori Amos or Fiona Apple - and Elvis Costello and Prince have cited her as a prime influence.
SOH

15 Brian Eno
Discreet Music (1975)

Brian Eno, it is said, invented ambient music when he was stuck in a hospital bed unable to reach a radio that was playing too quietly, giving him the eureka moment that set the course not only for his post-Roxy Music career as an 'atmosphere'-enhancing producer, but for the future of electronic music.

Without this ... we wouldn't have David Bowie's Low or Heroes, the echoey guitars of U2'S The Edge, and no William Orbit, Orb, Juana Molina. To name but a few.
LH

16 Aretha Franklin
I Never Loved a Man the Way I love You (1967)

'R-E-S-P-E-C-T. Find out what it means to me!' Is there a more potent female lyric in pop? Franklin's Atlantic Records debut unleashed her soulful ferociousness upon an unsuspecting public, and both the singer and her album quickly became iconic symbols of black American pride.

Without this ... Tina Turner, Mariah Carey, girl power would not exist, and rudeboys would not spit 'res'pec' through kissed teeth.
EJS

Posted: Jul 26, 2006 1:21 am
 
17 The Stooges
Raw Power (1973)

Produced by David Bowie, who also helped re-form the band, Raw Power was the Stooges's late swansong, and their most influential album. The Detroit group were already legendary for incendiary live shows and first two albums, but Raw Power, though selling as poorly as its predecessors, was subsequently cited as a prime influence by virtually every group in the British punk scene.

Without this ... no punk, so no Sex Pistols (who covered 'No Fun'); no White Stripes.
SOH

18 The Clash
London Calling (1979)

The best record to come out of punk, or punk's death knell? On this double album, The Clash fused their rockabilly roots with their love of reggae, moving away from the choppy snarls of the scene that birthed them. This was the album that legitimised punk - hitherto a stroppy fad - into the rock canon. Its iconic cover, and songs about the Spanish Civil War brought left-wing politics firmly into musical fashion.

Without this ... would the west have come to love reggae, dub and ragga quite so much? We certainly would have no Manic Street Preachers ... or Green Day, or Rancid ... or possibly even Lily Allen.
KE

19 Mary J Blige
What's the 411? (1992)

When the Bronx-born 'Queen of Hip Hop Soul' catapulted her debut on to a legion of approving listeners, she unwittingly defined a new wave of R&B. Before Mary, R&B's roots were still firmly planted in soul and jazz (ie Aretha Franklin and Chaka Khan). The emergence of hip hop and this album from Blige and her mentor and producer Sean 'Puffy' Combs (aka P Diddy) gave birth to a new gritty sound, informed by the singer's harrowing past.

Without this ... no R&B/soul divide, which means no TLC, Beyonce, or Ashanti, to name just three.
EJS

20 The Byrds
Sweetheart of the Rodeo (1968)

At one inspired stroke, Sweetheart vanquished the cultural divide between acid-munching, peace-preaching long hairs and beer-swilling, flag-waving good old boys by creating the enduring hybrid of country-rock. Allying rippling guitars and silky vocal harmonies with a mix of country tradition ('I Am a Pilgrim') and Gram Parsons originals, the record irrevocably altered the perspective of two previously averse streams of Americana. The group even cut their hair to play the Grand Ole Opry.

Without this ... no Hotel California, no Willie Nelson, no Shania Twain.
NS

21 The Spice Girls
Spice (1996)

The music business has been cynically creating and marketing acts since the days of the wax cylinder, but on nothing like the scale of the Spice phenomenon, which was applied to crisps, soft drinks, you name it. Musically, the Spice's Motown-lite was unoriginal, but 'Girl Power', despite being a male invention, touched a nerve and defined a generation of tweenies who took it to heart.

Without this ... five-year-olds would not have become a prime target for pop marketeers. Most of all, there'd be no Posh'n'Becks.
NS

22 Kate Bush
The Hounds of Love (1985)

On Side One our Kate strikes a deal with God, throws her shoes in a lake and poses as a little boy riding a rain machine. Turn over, and she's drowning, exorcising demons and dancing an Irish jig. All this to a soundscape that employs the shiniest synthesised studio toys the Eighties had to offer in the service of one women's unique yet utterly English musical genius. Listen again to the delirious cacophany of 'Running Up That Hill', and it sounds like God struck that deal.

Without this ... Tori Amos would have spawned no earthquakes, Alison Goldfrapp would lack her juiciest cherries and romance would have withered on the vine.
JB

23 Augustus Pablo
King Tubby Meets Rockers Uptown (1976)

Jamaica's invention of dub - a stripped-down, echo-laden instrumental remix of a vocal track - was spawned principally on the B-sides of local reggae hits and in the island's competing sound-systems, with technician-engineer King Tubby as its master creator, a man who could 'play' the mixing console. This collection of ethereal melodies by melodica maestro Augustus Pablo distilled the art into album form. It would be years before the West caught up.

Without this ... no DJ remixes, no house, no rave.
NS

24 Youssou N'Dour
Immigres (1984)

The charismatic N'Dour, Senegal's top star, changed the West's perception of African musicians, just as he had revolutionised Senegalese music. Nothing sounded like the fusion on Immigres, with its lopsided rhythms, whooping talking drums and discordant horns, topped by N'Dour's supple, powerful vocals. Immigres also redefined the role of West African griot, addressing migration and African identity.

Without this ... N'Dour wouldn't have met Peter Gabriel, there'd have been no African presence at Live 8. In fact, 'world music' would not exist as a section in Western collections.
NS

25 James Brown
Live at the Apollo (1963)

This remains the live album by which all others are measured, and is still the best delineation of the raw power of primal soul music. It propelled James Brown into the mainstream, and paved the way for a string of propulsive hits like 'Papa's Got a Brand New Bag' (1965) and 'Cold Sweat' (1967). The catalyst for many great soul stylists, from Sly Stone to Otis Redding, it also provided an early lesson in dynamics for the young Michael Jackson.

Without this ... great chunks of hip hop - which has sampled Brown more than almost any other - would be missing.
SOH

26 Stevie Wonder
Songs in the Key of Life (1976)

This influenced virtually every modern soul and R&B singer, brimming with timeless classics like 'Isn't She Lovely', 'As' and 'Sir Duke'. The 21-tracker encompassed a vast range of life's issues - emotional, social, spiritual and environmental - all performed with bravado and a lightness of touch. No other R&B artist has sung about the quandaries of human existence with quite the same grace.

Without this ... no Alicia Keys, no John Legend - contemporary R&B would be empty and lifeless.
EJS

27 Jimi Hendrix
Are You Experienced (1967)

Looking and playing like a brother from another planet, Hendrix delivered the most dramatic debut in pop history. Marrying blues and psychedelia, dexterity and feedback trickery, it redefined the guitar's sonic possibilities, while beyond the fretboard pyrotechnics burnt a fierce artistic vision - 'Third Stone From the Sun' made Jimi rock's first (and still best travelled) cosmonaut.

Without this ... countless guitarists and cock-rockers might not have been (Stevie Ray Vaughan, Lenny Kravitz, even Miles Davis owes him), but most of all, without Experienced, there'd be no Jimi experience.
NS

28 Prince and the Revolution
Purple Rain (1984)

Prince had been plugging away with limited success for several years when the man in tiny pants reinvented himself as a purple-clad movie star. Like Michael Jackson, he felt that the way to gain crossover appeal was to run the musical gamut: in this case, from the minimalist funk of his earlier albums to the volume-at-11 rock of Jimi Hendrix. The title track is a monumental, fist-clenching rock ballad that, perversely, whetted our appetites for far worse examples by Christina Aguilera among others.

Without this ... no Janet Jackson, no Peaches, and certainly no Beck.
LH

29 Pink Floyd
The Dark Side of the Moon (1973)

Sounds like it was pretty tough to be in Pink Floyd in the early 1970s. You had all the money you could spend (ker-ching!) but you thought that was vulgar. You didn't get on with your bandmates because they all had superiority complexes. You couldn't enter the recording booth without having an existential crisis. Piper At The Gates of Dawn, their debut with the late Syd Barrett, turned out to be influential in a more positive sense (David Bowie, Blur).

Without this ... there'd be no Thom Yorke solo mumblings, and much less prog rock (if only ...).
LH

30 The Wailers
Catch a Fire (1973)

Alongside The Harder They Come (movie and soundtrack), Catch a Fire changed the perception of reggae from eccentric, lightweight pop to a music of mystery and power. Dressed in a snappy Zippo lighter sleeve, and launched with rock razzmatazz, it delivered a polished, guitar-sweetened version of what Bob Marley, Peter Tosh and Bunny Wailer had made when white audiences weren't listening. By turns militant, mystic and sexy, it helped make Bob Marley the first Third World superstar.

Without this ... no Aswad or Steel Pulse, no native American or Maori or African reggae bands.
NS

31 The Stone Roses
The Stone Roses (1989)

Until the late Eighties, Manchester was thought to be a forbidding, dour place where the ghost of Ian Curtis still clanked about. The Stone Roses' concatenation of sweet West Coast psychedelia and the lairy, loved-up rave culture was as unforeseeable as it was seismic. Ecstasy pulled the sniffy rock kids away from their Smiths records and into clubland; the result was an album whose woozy words and funky drumming sounded as guileless as it did hedonistic.

Without this ... well, a bit of the Roses remains in the DNA of every British guitar band since.
KE

32 Otis Redding
Otis Blue (1965)

Until Stax Records and Otis Redding arrived, the Southern states were a place you had to leave to make it (unless you were a country singer). Recorded weeks after the death of Redding's idol, Sam Cooke, the album cast Otis as Cooke's successor, an embodiment of young black America with white appeal - alongside Cooke's 'A Change is Gonna Come' was the Stones's 'Satisfaction'. With terrific backings from the MGs and the Markeys horns behind Otis's rasping vocals, it defined 'soul'.

Without this ... no Aretha Franklin singing 'Respect', no Al Green, and no Terence Trent D'Arby.
NS

33 Herbie Hancock
Head Hunters (1973)

It definitively wedded jazz to funk and R&B, and did it with such joyful confidence that it launched a whole new, open-minded approach to the music. Equally important was the use of electronic keyboards, then in their infancy, which vastly expanded the range of available textures. Head Hunters kickstarted the stylistic and ethnic fusions that have enlivened jazz for 30 years.

Without this .
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 1:21 am
 
34 Black Sabbath
Black Sabbath (1970)

A mere 30 minutes long, this was none the less the album where heavy metal was first forged. Its ponderous tempos, cod-satanic imagery (bassist Geezer Butler was a Roman Catholic and Dennis Wheatley fan), Tony Iommi's sledgehammer guitar riffs and Ozzy Osbourne's shrieking vocals all went on to define the genre and shaped most arena rock of the Seventies and Eighties.

Without this ... no Spinal Tap, no grunge or Kurt Cobain and, of course, no Osbournes.
NS

35 The Ramones
The Ramones (1976)

'Fun disappeared from music in 1974,' claimed singer Joey Ramone. To restore it took he and his three 'brothers' just one album and 16 tracks, all under three minutes. Brevity was the New York punk rockers' first lesson to the world, along with speed, a distorted guitar thrash and a knowing line in faux-dumb lyrics. In an era of 'progressive' rock pomposity and 12-minute tracks, the Ramones' back-to-basics approach was rousing and confrontational.

Without this ... no fun.
NS

36 The Who
My Generation (1965)

Alongside the equally influential Small Faces, The Who were the quintessential British mod group. Long before they recorded the first rock opera, Tommy, they unleashed a stream of singles that articulated all the youthful pent-up frustration of Sixties London before it started to swing. Their 1965 debut album, My Generation, included the defiant and celebratory 'The Kids Are Alright' and the ultimate mod anthem, 'My Generation', with its infamous line, 'I hope I die before I get old.' Angry aggressive art-school pop with attitude to burn.

Without this ... no Paul Weller, no Blur and, God help us, no Ordinary Boys either.
NS

37 Massive AttackBlue Lines (1991)

Obliterators of rap's boundaries, Massive Attack pioneered the cinematic trip hop movement. After graduating from one of Britain's premier sound systems, the Bristol-based Wild Bunch, Andrew 'Mushroom' Vowles and Grant 'Daddy G' Marshall joined forces with graffiti artist 3D. Massive Attack's debut LP spawned the unforgettable 'Unfinished Sympathy' and remains a modern classic.

Without this ... no Roots Manuva, no Dizzee. In fact, there would be no British urban music scene to speak of.
EJS

38 Radiohead
The Bends (1995)

In parallel with Jeff Buckley, Radiohead's Thom Yorke popularised the angst-laden falsetto, a thoughtful opposite to the chest-beating lad-rock personified by Oasis's Liam Gallagher. Sounding girly to a backdrop of churning guitars became a much-copied idea, however, one which eventually coalesced into an entire decade of sound.

Without this ... Coldplay would not exist, nor Keane, nor James Blunt.
KE

39 Michael Jackson
Thriller (1982)

Pure, startling genius from beginning to end, Michael Jackson and producer Quincy Jones seemed hellbent on creating the biggest, most universally appealing pop album ever made. Jones introduced elements of rock into soul and vice versa in such a way that it's now no surprise to hear a pop record that mashes up more marginal genres into a form that will have universal relevance.

Without this ... no megastars such as Justin Timberlake or Madonna, no wide-appeal uber-producers such as Timbaland or Pharrell Williams.
LH

40 Run DMC
Run DMC (1984)

Before them came block-rocking DJ Grandmaster Flash and the Godfather, Afrika Bambaataa, but it was Run DMC who carved the prototype for today's hip hop MCs. Their self-titled debut - the first rap album to go gold - was rough around the edges and catchy as hell. As Rev Run spat, 'Unemployment at a record high/ People coming, people going, people born to die', the way was paved for conscious and political rap.

Without this ... no Public Enemy, Roots and Nas.
EJS

41 Chic
Chic (1977)

The Chic Organisation revolutionised disco music in the late Seventies, reclaiming it from the naff Bee Gees and ensuring the pre-eminence of slickly produced party music in the charts for the next three decades. Its main men Nile Rodgers and Bernard Edwards patented a sound on their 1977 debut that was influential on bands from Duran Duran to Orange Juice. They also created a hit-making formula that mixed dance beats with monster hooks.
Without this ... no Destiny's Child.
LH

42 The Smiths
The Smiths (1984)

Yearning, melodic, jangly, and very northern, The Smiths' first album was quite unlike anything that had gone before. It helped that Morrissey was a one-off and that Johnny Marr had taken all the best riffs from Sixties pop, punk and disco and melded them into his own unique style. But there was something magical about their sound that endless successors have tried to replicate.

Without this ... there'd be no Belle and Sebastian, no Suede, no Oasis, and no Libertines - at the very least.
LH

43 Primal Scream
Screamadelica (1991)

Thanks to producer Andrew Weatherall and some debauched raving, this former fey indie outfit enthusiastically took on dance music's heady rushes. It was a conversion bordering on the Damascene, but one being mirrored in halls of residence, cars, clubs and bedsits all around the nation. Screamadelica brought hedonism crashing into the mainstream.

Without this ... no lad culture - it was no accident that a mag founded in 1994 shared its name with Screamadelica's defining single, 'Loaded'.
KE

44 Talking Heads
Fear of Music (1979)

There's something refreshingly jolly about the modern-life paranoia expressed by chief Talking Head David Byrne on this album that moany old Radiohead could learn from. Opening track 'I Zimbra' splices funk with afrobeat, paving the way for Byrne and Eno's mould-breaking My Life in the Bush of Ghosts album a few years later.

Without this ... Paul Simon's Graceland might never have been made.
LH

45 Fairport Convention
Liege and Lief (1969)

The birth of English folk-rock. Considered an act of heresy by folk purists, this electrified album fragmented the band. No matter, the opening cry of 'Come all you roving minstrels' proved galvanic.

Without this ... no Celtic revivalists like the Pogues and Waterboys or descendants like the Levellers.
NS

46 The Human League
Dare (1981)

Until Dare, synthesisers meant solemnity. Phil Oakey's reinvention of the group as chirpy popsters, complete with two flailing, girl-next-door vocalists, feminised electronica.

Without this ... and Oakey's lop-sided haircut, squads of new romantics and synth-pop acts would have been lost.
NS

47 Nirvana
Nevermind (1991)

You might argue Nirvana's landmark album changed nothing whatsoever. All their best seditious instincts came to nothing, after all. And yet Nevermind still rocks mightily, capturing a moment when the vituperative US underground imposed its agenda on the staid mainstream. Without this ... no Seattle scene, no Britpop, no Pete Doherty.
KE

48 The Strokes
Is This It? (2001)

Five good-looking young men hauled the jangling sound of Television and the Velvet Underground into the new millennium, reinvigorating rock's obsession with having a good time.

Without this ... a fine brood of heirs would not have been spawned: among them, Franz Ferdinand and the Libertines.
KE

49 De La Soul
3 Feet High and Rising (1989)

Ten years after hip hop's arrival, its original joie de vivre had been subsumed by macho braggadocio. Three Feet High made hip hop playful again, with light rhythms, unusual sound samples and its talk of the D.A.I.S.Y. age ('Da Inner Sound Y'all') earning the trio a 'hippy' label.

Without this ... thoughtful hip hop acts like the Jungle Brothers and PM Dawn wouldn't have arrived.
NS

50 LFO
Frequencies (1991)

Acid house was sniffed at as a fad until it started producing 'proper' albums. Frequencies was its first masterpiece. Updating the pristine blueprint of Kraftwerk with house, acid, ambient and hip hop, it made dance music legitimate to album-buyers.

Without this ... no success for Orbital, Underworld, Leftfield, Chemical Brothers or Aphex Twin.
KE

· Have your say

Restricting our anniversary list to a mere 50 was a tortuous process. We know you have opinions on these highly emotive matters, so join the debate and make a case for your choice of record at observer.co.uk/blog
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 1:38 am
 
Unlike most top 50 lists, I like a lot of those records, the whole "without this, this band wouldn't have happened" thing is total horseshit.

Yeh the Pistols wouldn't have formed if Ziggy Stardust never came out.....right.....
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 1:48 am
 
This is the best of the lists that have been posted so far for sure. The top of the list is great, it starts getting sketchy part way down the line, but even some things I don't care for obviously deserve to be a part of this.

A better name would be 50 albums that changed POPULAR music.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 1:56 am
 
And why aren't there any Motorhead records on the list?
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 2:31 am
 
Where the fuck was the Barclay James Harvest??!?!?!??!? This list is wack, Mack.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 3:07 am
 
A better name would be 50 albums that changed POPULAR music.

good point. Yeah there are some outrageous claims...the "Sweetheart of the Rodeo" entry saying without it there would be no "Willie Nelson" is so ridiculous. Also, the first Pink Floyd LP changed the way pop music is made and recorded more than "Dark Side..."

you can tell this is a British list...who the fuck has even thought about The Stone Roses or Primal Scream in the last 10 years except them? Didnt change much except for making bad drugs cool for a short amount of time.

James Brown should be at the top of that list...he invented modern music...

i'll stop, lists are stupid....



Pretty Dumb list
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 3:21 am
 
you can tell this is a British list

I was gonna say the exact same thing!

24 Youssou N'Dour
Immigres (1984)

Love this album. ...
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 3:57 am
 
ornette coleman is missing
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 4:06 am
 
Oi vey. I hate these lists because they aren't written by music fans, but by sociology majors. You know, "What are the sociological implications of this record?" type stuff. You can spot these douche bags a mile away at any show. Arms crossed, politely bobbing their heads if they aren't acting totally bored. Bullshit. Too many UK rock critic NME bullshit bands like The Strokes, The Stone Roses, Massive Attack, and Primal Scream. The Spice Girls are on the list but no ABBA or THe Ronettes or The Monkees??? No Kinks records?!? But the fucking Human League is on the list?!? Gimme a break.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 4:34 am | Edited by: Crystal Lake
 
16 Aretha Franklin
I Never Loved a Man the Way I love You (1967)

Without this ... Tina Turner... would not exist


uhhh...
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 4:36 am
 
troy just got done listening to joni mitchell (#14) which he really likes. now he's playing the spice girls (#21) and i see he plans to spend some time later listening to dark side of the moon or the smiths, but he likes em so much he's having a hard time making up his mind...

I was more talking about VU, Ramones, Robert Johnson, Otis Redding, Who, NWA, Black Sabbath

But yeh I'm really into the Spice Girls and the Smiths right now
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 4:40 am
 
The Smiths are alright.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:19 am | Edited by: Mark Rochambeaux
 
My view on the Spice Girls is like the Julia Louis Dreyfuss skit on Saturday night Live.

"Who's your favorite Ghostbuster?"

"I like the black one!"
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:31 am
 
Don't get me wrong, I like the Spice Girls. Way more than Patti Smith, that is for sure! In fact, put "Horses" out to pasture (har, har, har!) and keep the Spice Girls on the list and I'm happy.

And Joni Mitchell's "Both Sides Now" is a favorite, no problem with her on the list. I really am a sucker for the bad folky shit like Joni Mitchell & Linda Ronstadt. It's way more severe than a lot of punk rock out there.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:46 am
 
"changed music" hahahahaha
all 50 of those shitbirds helped create the industry you all suck tits on...
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 3:04 pm
 
I think you guys are looking at it wrong though...

hear me out...

It's not that those artists wouldn't "exist", it's that if those artists had not been commercially viable then record labels might not have put out those next records. Like it or not, the music industry and popular culture have and had a lot to do with the records that have gotten released, made it to radio and became hits. Sure, before the internet you dug in record bins, read zines, and blah blah blah...but someone had to discover it to put it out there for you to discover it... it doesn't just happen. Records get discovovered, for the most part, through some sort of promotion, and that promotion is built off the success of other records...

now you may commence in telling me why I am wrong.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 3:28 pm
 
No Hank Williams? Suspect.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 3:42 pm
 
Rachel, I don't think your wrong in that statement. But I think you'l find that most folks here don't want to be a part of the music industry and popular culture commercial system. And even if we are looking at just popular music, then there are some serious problems with the list. The originating authors' opinions are just that, even if they are rather shallow and superficial.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 3:52 pm
 
23 Augustus Pablo
King Tubby Meets Rockers Uptown (1976)


Dope.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 3:52 pm
 
Without this ... no Alicia Keys, no John Legend - contemporary R&B would be empty and lifeless.

It is!
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 4:48 pm
 
think you'l find that most folks here don't want to be a part of the music industry and popular culture commercial system


yeah, but that's kind of like saying, "I don;t agree with our government so I'm gonna pretend like it doesn't exist."

it's there, it effects everything, ignoring it won't make it go away. Everything that is popular isn't shit. That's a short-sighted belief. part of my job is to talk to musicians about their influences, and they all admit to some popular influence - plus, without writing a list based on years of study, the line of thought presented in the above list is the one that is the most obvious, as whoever wrote it was probably payed about $150 to write it, hardly worth more than a days research.

which brings me to the point that was made about the lack of research done by most "music" writers - with the overabundance of places to read about music now, economically, it just doesn't work out the way it once did. It's not that people don't care or want to do a good job, but quantity pays the bills.

I'm not saying that this is good..I am just trying to add perspective - so take a breath.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 4:51 pm
 
yeah, but that's kind of like saying, "I don;t agree with our government so I'm gonna pretend like it doesn't exist."
Welcome to the Ruby Ridge of music, my dear.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:22 pm
 
"I think you guys are looking at it wrong though..."

Soz, missus, I think you're buying into the whole music software/hardware/retail buuuuull-shittt by even thinking that ALBUM LISTS are any kind of barometer of creative flow ...

The whole form of this kinda exercise is WACK IN THE EXTREME ...

Any damn fule know that most people (i.e. regular folks, musicians, even Goners) are more likely to have their lives/music changed by as little as a four-bar guitar solo in a Ricky Nelson number (see: Beck, Jeff), the B-side of a half-remembered 45 (virtually anyone), or a gig ...

Music, for the last frikkin' time, DOES NOT NATURALLY FORM ITSELF INTO CD OR VINYL ALBUM LENGTH CHUNKS AND IS NOT NATURALLY CONSUMED AS THIS - THE ALBUM LIST FORMAT IS A BULLSHIT MARKETING EXERCISE!

Now, please, use your journalism degree (or whatever) to find out which bits/offcuts/moments/ideas REALLY changed music/lives?
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:33 pm
 
this is admittedly just one peice of the puzzle ... WHY ARE YOU YELLING?
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:37 pm
 
People are passionate about this stuff. I wouldn't take it personally. They're not yelling at you. They're "yelling" about the articles.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:43 pm
 
Ryan Adams! Ryan Adams!
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:44 pm
 
I mean, Not Ryan Adams! Not Ryan Adams!
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 5:44 pm
 
Cos it's 32 degrees in London, which seems like being in the very bowels of hell (it's the concrete), and I'm completely fed up of reading bullshit lists of 'best' 'most influential' albums, a great percentage of which are generated here in the UK, and are usually followed by such phrases as 'if you would like to purchase copies of these albums' or 'is proud to sponsor' ...

Sorry for shouting, but it's yet another example of editorial laziness to run these lists, but I never really expected owt else from the upper class wanker with a double-barrelled surname who edits The Observer Music Monthly, from whence this particularly noxious example came ...

I'm a music obsessive, like most Goners, but there's still albums that I've owned for 20 years, been massively influenced by a coupla cuts, and never played the second side - sorry, but that's how a lot of people 'consume' music - there ain't THAT many albums which are awesome all the way through, after all. How many copies of, say, Revolver are worn through Yellow Submarine, but yanked off before Tomorrow Never Knows? Or vice versa? Y'see, this album lists stuff is BULLSHIT!

How about a list of singular moments in music which changed people's lives?
How about a list of albums/45s/half-heard songs/haircuts in music which changed people's lives?
How about no music lists at all?
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 6:48 pm
 
think you'l find that most folks here don't want to be a part of the music industry and popular culture commercial system


yeah, but that's kind of like saying, "I don;t agree with our government so I'm gonna pretend like it doesn't exist."



Rachel, think about this statement along the lines of Memphis music especially...Memphis music that has changed the world has exsisted OUTSIDE of the corporate universe of publicists, TV and other non essential musical things...and I am not talking about Sun and Stax, although they are prime examples...lets look at the legacy of this very board...the Goner aesthetic, which I think one could very easily say was kickstarted by the Oblivians. Three guys whose music was was primarily fueled by just passion for music, booze and wanting to tear some shit up. This dirty panty, gutter gospel rock they created inspired bands from around the world. People in 20 years are still going to be wanting Oblivians records, I dont think in 20 years folks are going to give a fuck about some dipshit indie rock band that really "caused a stir" and some stupid CMJ conference. Partly because it isnt really "real". People fly into Memphis from around the world to attend Goner fest...why? beacuse it represents something that is real. Shit, even though jay reatard is not my cup of tea, I can recognize the fact that people around the world love his brand of rock...folks in 20 years are gonna want his records.
The corporate world is a reality, but not a necessity to creating real music. Yes you need it to "move some units", or to properly define a demographic...but music that exsists solely in that world isnt really changing anything...That world has no loyalty to bands or their music, that is why there is a different flavor of the month every month. Music lovers are passionate about their music, Bands made up of passionate music lovers do not care about the corporate machine, publicists, "hot lists"...you dont hand over something you are dedicated to to teams of lawyers and stylists.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 7:05 pm
 
Lists like this are seriously gay. How can anyone argue that KATE BUSH of all people had a bigger influence on music than the Kinks?!?!?!??!?!?? Also I know that this list is limited to LPs, but shouldn't Chuck Berry be right near the top of any list of influential musicains?!?!??!?? Gimmie a break!
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 7:49 pm
 
now you may commence in telling me why I am wrong


Why do you do this to yourself? I am not being rude. I really, really want to know why.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 7:51 pm
 
One of the reviewers from Dusted compared one of my songs to Kate Bush and I've been contemplating checking out some of her stuff, but I don't really know what to check out and every description I read of her work doesn't really help.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 7:53 pm
 
One of the reviewers from Dusted compared one of my songs to Kate Bush

Remind me to never check out your band.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 8:05 pm
 
I picked this one up (along with the Le Club des Chats and Standard Tribesmen singles) from S-S, a label which happily reissues lost singles and cassette-only tracks from the diaspora of the '80s DIY underground. Pink Reason might be new, but totally reaches back to that period of musical isolation, with a truly frozen, loner vibe that is all but lost on those who are playing outside of sex/drugs/rock/roll motivations. No, demons are being let loose here, the kind that smell like mildew and haunt basements. It's one mysterious guy named Kevin and he's channeling the solitude in a way that hasn't felt this complete since Luxurious Bags hung it up. Claustrophobic mope done right; a 5 A.M. comedown vibe that shivers where it would otherwise warm, with ten-dollar organ floating in and around the premises, even-keeled and truly on its own amidst a sea of garage-punk types. "New Violence" gets close to Kate Bush territory regardless of the speed it's played at, and is my favorite here, though the other tunes are definitely no slouch, and "Throw It Away" comes as close to a conventional psychedelic figurine sound as anything I've heard recently. Challenging, inspired, and not easy to shake.

By the way, don't forget to pick up my record, Joe. Next one is on Trick Knee.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 8:07 pm
 
i'd rather listen to guinea pigs than read these lists.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 9:21 pm
 
are you out of guinea pigs?

but seriously, no one has to read this if it upsets your constitution, I was looking more for arguments for or against the inclusion of certain ones than an expository on why lists suck.

I do read other message boards, but this one is the most derogatory, so it helps balance things out...
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 9:29 pm
 
I'd rather copulate with (multiple) guinea pigs than read any more of one woman's attempt to define herself on a message board. I'm talking to you rachel.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 9:38 pm
 
what? all that derrida and you wanna keep to the "subject at hand"?

seems like you didn't need to read all that deconstructionism if you were gonna be so literal.

not so heavy meta.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 9:41 pm
 
if she wants to get meta-physical I can take her outside and try to knock some sense into her.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 10:10 pm | Edited by: Rachelandthecity
 
what? all that derrida and you wanna keep to the "subject at hand"?


everything I say is in jest, it's fine with me whichever way the conversation turns, of course, unless it turns for some reason into personal attacks, which for some reason, it often does...

billibob, who has hinted that he knows me in rl - but has yet to reveal himself - would have nothing to say at all if he wasn't addressing me...obsessed much?
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 10:13 pm
 
no one is as obsesssed with you as you are!
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 10:14 pm
 
just shut up please.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 10:14 pm
 
not you billy bob.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 10:38 pm
 
I know, I suck, we got it!

Back to the point...

I dont think in 20 years folks are going to give a fuck about some dipshit indie rock band that really "caused a stir" and some stupid CMJ conference. Partly because it isnt really "real". People fly into Memphis from around the world to attend Goner fest...why? beacuse it represents something that is real.

A lot more people go to CMJ every year than Gonerfest. how can you make a blanket statement that their tastes and experiences aren't real? I don't want to rehash arguments that have already been made on this board...but real is relative.

I don't think the writer's points carry any more or any less weight than anyone else's - it's just an opinion. it doesn't make them evil for having one.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 10:43 pm
 
People disagree about music. A lot.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 10:44 pm
 
for god's sake rachel get off the computer & go call up a friend.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 11:12 pm
 
A lot more people go to CMJ every year than Gonerfest. how can you make a blanket statement that their tastes and experiences aren't real? I don't want to rehash arguments that have already been made on this board...but real is relative.

I don't think the writer's points carry any more or any less weight than anyone else's - it's just an opinion. it doesn't make them evil for having one.



you dont get what I am trying to say...a CMJ fest is little more than a musical equivilent of a car show or electronics expo..."here are the new products for '06!"....goner bands dont "move 100,000 units", they arent in bullshit magazines like "spin" with full page spreads...they garner international followings without this extraneous bullshit....back to my Oblivians reference, take the Hives for example...well known for absolutely being in love with the Oblivians, but they are a corporate, tiger beat poster boys for "garage rock", yeah they sold a lot of records, but do you think anyone will remember them or give a shit about them in 20 years? NO. Will people give a shit and remember the Oblivians in 20 years..yes they will. Remember the Oblivians reunion show on halloween a few years back? Folks from all over the world made a pilgrimage to Memphis to see them...a band they only knew from the little 7" and 12" records they made and people fell in love with the music first and foremeost, not because of some magazine's hype, or mussy haired photoshoot, or some rock journalist's meaningless, google researched words...it is real. I dont care if a bazillion people go to a CMJ conference, it really isnt about music.

But I am sorry...you claim that a writer's opinion carries no more weight than the average person, but said writer's think that their knowledge and criticism of music is important enough to make a living out if it, or at least make some money. No music-obsessed fan on the Goner board thinks their opinion deserves them a living. I think if a person is willing to say "I am a music writer, I want to make my living off of it" they need to be able to know more than most writers in the music magazine game are demostrating now-a-days....just my uncompensated opinion.
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 11:27 pm
 
that lame list made rolling stone seem hip. enough rachelinthecity already!!!
Posted: Jul 26, 2006 11:42 pm
 
enough rachelinthecity already!!!


Amen!
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 12:27 am
 
you've got to be kidding me!

I'm here to learn, I want your opinions. I'm listening. trying to do that research thing..but I get shit because I question an answer?

if you don't want to read it...turn it off.
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 12:31 am
 
I think the answer you're looking for has been given!
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 2:27 am
 
Rachel, It seems that you are really here to "borrow" others opinions as your own in writing. Or maybe you're just trying to take these opinions, blend them together, and cobble one together for yourself. Either way, you're not being honest with yourself or any of us about your motives. And it seems really sad to me that you will not stop posting inane stuff over and over, as if by sheer number you can wear us out and make us care about your lame, boring topics. And enough with the cut and paste stuff.
Here's another thought - why don't you attribute your writings and ideas to their proper sources, that way it's not what's known as PLAGARISM.

And don't say one more time anything to the tune of "if you don;t like it don't read it" because you are everywhere on this board, all damn day long, and impossible to escape.
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 5:15 pm
 
HA!

Everybody thinks they're a fucking genius on a fucking message board.

I was just looking for some general reactons to all the lists that are coming out - and of course, here it turns into some kind of issue. I'm sorry you were compelled to read a list and it turned into an attack of me plagarising something in an article you haven't even read. Wow! You must really have a high opinion on the brilliant things that are said on this board if you think I would steal ideas THAT I DON'T EVEN AGREE WITH.

As a fairly open-minded person, I like to hear the other side of the argument, I like to evaluate things, I like to discuss. Sue me.

It's amazing the rasial slurs, biggotry, stupid television shows and general idiocy that goes on around here and a stupid list bothers you - that I didn't even write?

There were three lists posted - sorry I overwhelmed you.
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 5:25 pm
 
lame.
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 6:05 pm | Edited by: Haunted George
 
Herb Alpert & The Tijauana Brass
South Of The Border (1964)

1964's South Of The Border peaked at #6 on the Billboard charts, and showed Herb's magic touch on some of the era's most popular hits. Covers of Jobim's "The Girl From Ipanema" and The Beatles' "All My Loving" were set alongside Spanish love songs.
Without this ... Thrift Store LP sections would be half empty.

Herb Alpert's Tijuana Brass
Whipped Cream & Other Delights (1965)

The landmark "Whipped Cream" album from 1965.
Without this ... Thrift Store LP sections wouldn't be the same.

Herb Alpert & The Tijuana Brass
Going Places (1965)

The Herb Alpert Signature Series continues with three additional titles, including Going Places. Released in October 1965, hot on the heels of the landmark Whipped Cream & Other Delights, Going Places spent 100 weeks in the Top 40, including six weeks at #1. Includes the hit singles "Tijuana Taxi," "3rd Man Theme," "Zorba the Greek," and "Spanish Flea" (later used as the Bachelor's Theme on The Dating Game.)
Without this ... No Dating Game Theme.

Herb Alpert & The Tijuana Brass
What Now My Love (1966)

The Herb Alpert Signature Series continues with three additional titles, including What Now My Love. Issued in April 1966, What Now My Love held the #1 spot for nine weeks, longer than any other Tijuana Brass album, and the title track garnered two Grammy® Awards.
Without this ... The world as we currently know it wouldn't exists.

Herb Alpert & The Tijuana Brass
S.R.O. (1966)

The Herb Alpert Signature Series continues with three additional titles, including SRO. In November 1966, Alpert released SRO, his fourth album to place in the Top 10 in 1966, ultimately reaching the #2 spot. Includes the hit singles "Work Song" and "Mame.
Without this ... Thrift Store LP sections would be half empty.
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 6:27 pm | Edited by: Haunted George
 
Martin Denny
Exotica (1957)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.

Martin Denny
Exotica Volume II (1958)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Forbidden Island (1958)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Primitiva (1958)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Hynotique (1959)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Primitiva (1958) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Afro-Desia (1959)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Exotica Volume III (1959)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Quiet Village (1959)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
The Enchanted Sea (1960)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Exotic Sounds from the Silver Screen (1960)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Exotic Sounds Visit Broadway (1960)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Exotic Percussion (1961)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Romantica (1961)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Martin Denny in Person (1962)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
A Taste of Honey (1962)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.

Martin Denny
Another Taste of Honey (1963)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Versatile (1963)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Taste of Hits (1964)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Latin Village (1964)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Hawaii Tattoo (1964)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Spanish Village (1965)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Golden Hawaiian Hits (1965)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Martin Denny (1966)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Hawaiian A Go-Go (1966)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Golden Greats (1966)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Hawaii (1966)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Exotica Today (1967)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Exotica Classica (1967)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
A Taste of India (1968)
There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Exotic Love (1968)

There are those who rate Exotic Moog (1969) or Hypnotique (1959) higher. But Exotica's made the watertight case for exotic jazz music as an art form in itself; until then, it was thought the silly, transient stuff of teenagers...
Without this ... Jungle Jazz would be a very different beast.


Martin Denny
Exotic Moog (1969)
There are those who rate Hypnotique (1959) higher but they are full o
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 6:36 pm
 
Yes, some of you have figured me out...I am writing something and using you guys as guinea pigs...


I was just looking for some general reactons to all the lists that are coming out - and of course, here it turns into some kind of issue.

Keep your story sraight. Which is it?
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 6:46 pm
 
how are those two things not the same?

here's my conclusion:

Some people really hate lists.

no one else can use that - it's mine.
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 6:52 pm
 
Here's a box of tissue. Take one and pass it along. You bunch of whiney ass buttholes.

I like lists. They usually drive me nuts but I like um.

Cheap Tricks debut should be on all list. Tunes about serial killers, suicide, the IRS, pervs, and gigolos. Gotta love it.
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 10:54 pm
 

It's amazing the rasial slurs, biggotry, stupid television shows and general idiocy that goes on around here and a stupid list bothers you - that I didn't even write?



please go back to Cryan Adams weblog and leave us idjits alone
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 11:10 pm
 
oH!

ya got me!

again!

That joke's not old or anything!

Hey, I hear CBS is looking for writers...
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 11:15 pm
 
oh
I hear there's plenty of other places in this cyberworld where people care about what you care about
Posted: Jul 27, 2006 11:52 pm
 
you should really stop before you make me cry.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 12:09 am | Edited by: Mark Beef
 
I don't want to make you cry...what with your taste in music and internet persona, crying seems to be something you enjoy

I, and it seems like others, would just like you to go away...or at least quit crappening up the board
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 12:16 am
 
ah, poor Goner Board...

I'd sure hate to crappen up.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 12:22 am
 
so we're in agreement
no more top random even number lists

and we won't shout rude things at Ryan Adams recitals

YAY WE ALL WIN!!!!!!! (except of course for the losers actually at the Ryan Adams recital)
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 12:44 am
 
Is this guy a legit music journalist http://www.jericsmith.com/sacredcows.htm After all he has a site you can link too. Notice the paralels
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 1:00 am
 
they came out with a book about this shit already too

reviewers panning critically acclaimed records after the fact


It was terrible...I didn't buy it...Justin from the Sneaky Pinks pawned it off on me cause my girlfriend gave him a ride to the airport

I KNOW GONER CELEBRITIES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 12:43 pm
 
Some of you people are actually so hip that you are square...
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 2:38 pm
 
i think that book was headed up by Jim DeRogatis. That guy is a dumbfuck. The epitome of why rock journalists should now and forever more either not be given jobs or just murdered.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 4:57 pm
 
Here's the deal - none of these far-reaching lists are good or will ever be any good. There's subjectivity inherent in the process, so the only good lists come from individuals listing their favorites. If Byron Coley listed his favorite 70s psych LPs, I'll bet it'd be a cool list. If Tim Warren did his top 100 fuzzgarage songs, you could argue but it'd be a logical and potentially helpful list ("gotta download that tune if Tim likes it so much"). But music crit lists try to throw at least one rap album on every top 100 punk list, or at least one hispanic band or some gal-fronted bands or whatever sociological non-concerns (this is music, pure and simple, not collectivism) - someone up top mentioned this. They try to show how hip and diverse and politically correct they are, they try to please everyone by including whatever special interest band, and they always miss the mark because I guarantee it's not even their TRUE list, what they actually enjoy listening to, so it's dishonest from the start. True music fans like everybody here (except Rachel) are able to make their own lists which are far more useful than the tools who write professionally for Rolling Stone and writers who wish to some day write for that useless music mag that rarely actually talks about music and has little on-staff musical knowledge to begin with.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 6:47 pm | Edited by: Rachelandthecity
 
Jesus Christ.

One of my freelance gigs is to write a bi-weekly peice on what people are talking about on the internet. A bunch of lists came out in the past couple of weeks and that's what I decided to focus on. I posted them here to see your reaction. I figured I would be shown a different point of view from the people that post here than more mainstream music listeners. I was trying to give you a voice, not make a statement on whats good.

And you know what, it worked, because I really didn't have any idea how hated such lists were - so, new point-of-view added to the mix - mission accomplished. Why this has turned into some sort of personal attack just shows why viewpoints from some people on this board carry so little weight.

The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference. That so much energy is put into making comments about me (whom no one who has done it even knows me) just shows that you have some sort of emotional stake wrapped up in this that clearly has nothing to do with me but your own inner fucked up heads.

I don't plan on running away because you "diss" me. I could really care less. All your doing is proving your idiocy to more people.

Oh, and think about this: I don't claim to be inside anyone'ss head, but I would imagine that some of the cracking down on this board is due to shit like this. Cause you know what? A lot of people (A LOT) lurk on this board because they don't want to get involved in arguments like these. Now, I don't care, cause I have a thick skin, I know where I've been and know where I am going - I make a living off just being me, so none of you bother me - but other people might not check out a "Goner" band - or shop at the Goner store or post on the Goner board - because of fear that they'll be ridiculed for having a different opinion - which is ironic because I thought that's what brought most people who hang around here together. I thought that we could all talk openly about what we like and not be ridiculed - cause isn't that what drove most of you haters to each other inthe first place? I'm not gonna apologize for not having a fucked up enough life that I carry my entrails around to slap all over anyone who I don't agree with.

And in the end - Goner is a business owned by Eric and Zac - not anyone else - and maybe you should let them decide who they want hanging around here.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 6:55 pm
 
Eric and Zac just told me they don't want you hanging around here anymore. Bazooka Joe and Elvis Presley nodded in agreement.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 6:58 pm
 
I'm the king of rock, there is none higher
Sucker MC's should call me sire
To burn my kingdom, you must use fire
I won't stop rockin' till I retire

Now we rock the party and come correct
Our cuts are on time and rhymes connect
Got the right to vote and will elect
And other rappers can't stand us, but give us respect

They called us and said we're gettin iller
There's no one chiller
It's not Michael Jackson and this is not Thriller
As one def rapper, I know I can hang
I'm Run from Run-DMC, like Kool from Kool and the Gang
Roll to the rock, rock to the roll
DMC stands for devestating mic control
You can't touch me with a ten foot pole
And I even made the devil sell me his soul

Now we crash through walls, cut through floors
Bust through ceilings and knock down doors
And when we're on the tape, we're fresh out the box
You can hear our sound for blocks and blocks
For every living person we're a purple treat
It's me and DMC, Jay where's the beat?

Now we're the baddest of the bad, the coolest of the cool
I'm DMC, I rock and roll. I'm DJ Run, I rock and rule
It's not a Trick or Treat and it's not a April Fool
It's all brand new, never ever old school

You got the music in your body and you can't comprehend
When your mind won't wiggle and your knees will bend
Music ain't nothin but a people's jam
It's DJ Run-DMC rockin without a band

Now I walked on ice and never fell
I spent my time in a plush hotel
I stood on many stages, held many mics
Take airplane flights, at huge heights
So all you sucker MC's, you gotta say please
Cause when he jumps high, I'm pulling down weeds
Got a song so strong, it's knocking down trees
Is it hard to believe it's Run-DMC

I am from, around the way
And Run goes to school, every day
And Jay plays the records he has to play
And we get down with no delay, HEY!
I rock the party with the words I speak
And Run says the rhymes that are unique
And Jay cuts the records every day of the week
And we are the crew that can never be beat
So don't try to diss me, try to be my friend
Cause if you do, you'll get yours in the end
The rhymes we say, shall set a trend
Because a devestating rap is what we send

Every jam we play, we break two needles
There's three of us but we're not the Beatles
My name is Darryl, you can call him D
You can call me Darryl Mack, or you can call him DMC
People always ask, "DMC, what does it mean?"
D's for never dirty, MC for mostly clean

Like we said before, we rock hardcore
I'm DJ Run, I can scratch. I'm DMC, I can draw
And now we got the knack, to attract
Our rhyme's an aphrodisiac
We'll reign on your brain and rock your knot
When it comes to rock, give it all we got
To be MC's, we got what it takes
Let the poppers pop and the breakers break
We're cool cool cats, it's like that
That's the way it is, so stay the hell back
We're causin hard times, for sucker MC's
Cause they don't make no songs like these
PERIOD!
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:00 pm
 
What's obviously bothering you is that there are a lot of smart and musically-obsessed/informed people who want no part of the crappy mainstream or semi-mainstream alterna-music you champion, and are plenty happy "not to have a voice." The only way to avoid the pollution that is the music industry at this point is to exist outside of it. Good luck to the Black Lips and anyone else who's giving it a shot, even if it's simply on the fringe, because they all deserve anything good that comes their way. Unfortunately, it's nearly impossible to reach a Spin top 10 as a current unit without sucking lots (LOTS) of dick and making forgettable rock 'n roll, unless it's token undergrounder Byron Coley (who regularly includes the Oblivians, for example). So yeah....what are you bitching about again?
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:10 pm
 
subjectivity inherent in the process, so the only good lists come from individuals listing their favorites

Finally, Tricknee is almost right about something.
this is a good thread
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:10 pm | Edited by: Ronnie Farnsworth
 
I don't think it's particularly healthy to just want to exist outside the "mainstream." I mean, the music industry (the big part) is run by people who don't know shit. They'll laugh at you if you say that, but they don't. Imagine if people who ran record labels actually put the stuff out because they liked it a la Ahmet Ertegun (back in the day, obviously not today) or more currently, Larry Hardy. You wouldn't want to exist "outside" then. I guess I'm trying to say I wish people that liked records still ran the big'uns.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:12 pm
 
oops now he's wrong again
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:25 pm
 
I guess I'm trying to say I wish people that liked records still ran the big'uns

Ill drink to that. hear hear.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:37 pm
 
It's not healthy to exist outside the mainstream, though it is healthier right now to exist outside the mainstream. If anyone can come up with a good number of examples to the contrary, let me know. I'm all about imposing my tastes on the nation, so give me the Brainbombs on MTV and Home Blitz on the radio....but let's be realistic. The industry simply isn't set up to reward artistic success, it's there to capitalize on teenagers who want image-heavy cuties and non-musicians who are happy to be sold as a commodity. Not to mention stiff genre-manipulation ghettos like Christian rock and neu metal. It's a mess. Is this a letter to MRR?
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:38 pm
 
That you, Zink?
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:39 pm
 
I ask because you make a good point, the mainstream writers are just as clueless as the mainstream record execs, and they all eat snails together rubbing their hands feverishly about some new hack with pretty hair who's gonna revolutionalize music. It's a shit circle that hopefully eats itself.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:40 pm
 
The industry simply isn't set up to reward artistic success, it's there to capitalize on teenagers who want image-heavy cuties and non-musicians who are happy to be sold as a commodity.

The sad (like, actually-in-real-life-truly-sad) truth. I guess it was never anything else really, but hey, Warner Bros. used to kick ass.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:41 pm
 
the irony of this thread is so thick i could spit.

no music writer likes good music

music writer comes to Goner Board to learn about good music

music writer shunned cause he/she was not born with this knowledge

in terms of writing about 'main stream alterna music" that I am accused of championg - I've written about many bands well-liked on this board - in a mainstream paper that didn't give two shits about any of them before I came along -and you know what? They were happy to get the coverage. Just this week I wrote about Oneida and The Gris Gris - are they on my list of best bands? No. But I can see where they fit in and why their shows are newsworthy.

Some people just like to complain - not solve problems - not work together to make something better - not build something. They just want to be miserable and feel better about themselves by making others look bad.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:45 pm
 
'tis, Trickknee....I really need to find something else to do.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:47 pm
 
I personally am just tired of your fingers/mouth blapping. of course I can only speak for myself.

Some people just like to complain

& some people just like to hear themselves talk.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:50 pm
 
Get down and start lickin'
Like it's a piece of Kentucky Fried Chicken
Pussy ain't nuthin' but skin and bone
so fuck it or suck or leave it alone

We're Latino and that's out image
Don't cross the line of scrimage!
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:51 pm
 
so why don't you stop clicking on this thread?

do you not understand how a forum works?
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:54 pm
 
Meeeerrrrrooowww!
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 7:56 pm
 
officer, I give up.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 8:10 pm | Edited by: Vinyl Ritchie
 

music writer comes to Goner Board WHICH IS OBVIOUSLY MADE OF MEMBERS WITH STRONG OPINIONS AND WHO ARE MUSIC OBSESSESIVES to learn about music THAT DOESNT MAKE SAID OBSESSIVES THROW UP A LITTLE IN THEIR MOUTHS

music writer shunned cause he/she DOESNT HAVE THE COMMON SENSE TO NOT POST ON A BOARD WHOSE MEMBERS DONT GIVE A SHIT ABOUT CURRENT CORPORATE/ ALTERNATIVE/ PSUEDO INDIE ROCK ABOUT SAID CRAP AND HAS LITTLE TO NO KNOWLEDGE OF THE MUSIC MOST MEMBERS OF THE GONER BOARD LISTEN TO/CELEBRATE


sorry to yell, but these might be the reasons people have such strong opinions about your posts
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 8:14 pm
 
Rachel, I think there is a huge gap in understanding here.

If you want to learn about good music, ask.

Everybody here knows what the mainstream is like; most have shilled out crap to the masses by working in one form or another in the "industry", whether it be radio, labels, distribution, making music, seeing music, or working in record stores and big-box chains.

We didn't like it. Being presented with lists of "hey, here's what some other people in the 'industry' think is good or bad or is relevant" is slightly off-putting. Not because of the poster, per se, but "We know, already". We come here to escape it.

These folks are tired of trying to change other's opinions, for the most part (see, "For those of you with square jobs..." and countless other threads here about trying to talk to other people about music). As I said before, welcome to the Ruby Ridge of Music. I'm not saying that anyone here doesn't like a single mainstream artist. But mainstream stuff isn't really why we're here.

I'm glad someone is trying to educate the masses; thank you. But for the most part, I just like talking with these folks about what I like, learning about new stuff, and getting different takes on everything, as well as goofing off in general.

I'm not sure of any other way of explaining it to you, other than, you just walked into the Antenna back in the day, and started handing out flyers for the Gin Blossoms down at the Daisy. Probably a bad analogy, but I'm guessing it's pretty close.

All above comments above are solely mine, and just my own peception of why you percieve a breakdown in communication.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 8:23 pm
 
You're O.K. Rachel... You're dressed like "The Evil Queen" from "Snow White & The Seven Dwarves" (1937) on your webpage. I love that movie. I own it on DVD.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 8:36 pm
 
One of my freelance gigs is to write a bi-weekly peice on what people are talking about on the internet.

where can we read this? thanks.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 8:55 pm
 
Gotta agree with the Tricknee comment that totally diverse records get thrown onto lists merely to showcase the writer's 'range'. Bah.

You want a list of the most infuential records? Just look at the Top 40 1956 - 2000, whatever is in the top ten is the most influential by default because thats what all the hacks and cover bands that dominate most cities' musical landscapes look to emulate. So records that changed the world are:

Eagles
Public Enemy
Fleetwood Mac
Herb Alpert
Beatles
Abba
Jackson 5
Mitch Miller
Neil Sedaka
Nirvana
Toto
etc.

And mainstream music is generally for people who don't really like 'new music' per se, but need background noise to merely distract them. Which is why 90% of most folks stop buying any new music once they hit 22 or 23, and concentrate on the job or the kids. Music at that point either transitions into mere nostalgia or an occasional chance meeting with a single record they like and buy/download at age 32...that reminds them of something they liked when they were 17.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 9:15 pm
 
One of my freelance gigs is to write a bi-weekly peice on what people are talking about on the internet.

where can we read this? thanks.



I'll post a link as soon it goes up.
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 9:20 pm
 
The only problem with your explanation jack - is I didn't ever say that the list was valid, good, or right. I never shared any opinion at all. I just wanted to see how people who don't read Rolling Stone would react to it. I wasnlt trying to steal an opinion, recruit anyone over to the dark side of Clear Channel, or anything like that.

somebody blamed the messenger...
Posted: Jul 28, 2006 9:32 pm
 
I didn't ever say that the list was valid, good, or right. I never shared any opinion at all
I understand this, but others here have REALLY strong opinions about it. Pasting it is kind of a "streeter" move to some, and some of those folks get punched in the face.

I just wanted to see how people who don't read Rolling Stone would react to it.
I think some folks have been trying to tell you in their own way that all those glossy mags are the same.

somebody blamed the messenger...
It's not that I think you don't know, but I can't believe you didn't expect the reaction. You were right; not everybody knows you, nor would they understand your original intention if you didn't say what that intention was from the get-go. You just said you were using us as guinea pigs. And you got your reactions here. But some of these rodents have really, really sharp teeth.
Posted: Jul 29, 2006 1:46 am
 
With all due respect Robin, I don't need anyone to explain to me why people are assholian...what I do wonder is why you feel the need to defend them. I mean is that really what you want this board to be about - everyone in agreement on what is appropriate to talk about and anyone who doesn't pass the test gets chewed up and spit out?

sounds like high school to me.
Posted: Jul 29, 2006 2:01 am
 
Oh, for fuck's sake. With all due respect, Rachel, I know some of these folks, too. I'm not defending them, I just understand their POV. I ain't defending anyone, not even you.

Fuck, man. Nevermind. I didn't talk to your ass in high school either.
Posted: Jul 29, 2006 2:32 am
 
just asking a question - damn.

I'm in a no win situation.

but I keep on trying.

no hard feelings - ya'll do whatever feels right.

I'll link the story when it goes up.
Posted: Jul 29, 2006 3:44 am
 
Goddammit Rachel, "Van Halen I" is absent from the list. I'm never talking to you again.
Posted: Jul 29, 2006 5:31 am
 
hey rachel-

it's a good list, although i think everyone disagrees with something about it. fuck em. i don't really think that primal scream or chic or massive attack really did much for the overall history of popular music, but again that's just my opinion.

i think someone said it up there earlier- the topic of "50 albums that changed music" is a bit broad. and if that were indeed the topic you wanted to pursue, i would throw on nirvana, john coltrane, charlie parker, chuck berry, louis armstrong, ny dolls, ...

popular music has such an exciting history, alot of people are really religious about knowing it. those people are called "music snobs". i've heard some of them hang around on this very board.

just keep writing and learning and don't claim to be the ultimate authority and you'll be fine. just put the phrase "...in my opinion" and you'll be cool.
Posted: Jul 29, 2006 6:32 am
 
The only problem with your explanation jack - is I didn't ever say that the list was valid, good, or right. I never shared any opinion at all. I just wanted to see how people who don't read Rolling Stone would react to it.

I think you did. Like Robin said, most of the people here have been involved with mainstream music, been fucked by the music industry, and/or generally don't want anything to do with it. These people are very passionate about the music they are involved with, and react just as passionately when their sensabilities are offended. They my be music snobs, but you really ought to know that by now. These kinds of lists are for educating people who don't already know the 50 greatests whatevers of all time compiled by an industry that doesn't give a fuck ABOUT the 50 greatests whatevers of all time, but rather selling Product X. "And look, here's a list of the 50 greatest Product Xs of all time for you to go add to your collection." Every one here already knows the 50 greatest records of all time, and it's a different 50 for every one of us. It also, probably, changes on a daily basis. That's why they attack these lists.

Now for why they attack you. People here don't like being used. They especially don't like being used by someone who embraces and works with the mainstream music industry. I think the people who are yelling for you to get off the Goner Board are out of line, but the people that would like you to stop cutting and pasting shit from other places when you know they don't give a damn about what you're posting make a lot of sense. If you have something genuine and interesting to contribute please do it. If you have something funny to say please do it. If you have a recipe for cooking a dog stuffed in a llama stuffed in a bison please give it to me, but also please stop using the Goner Board to further your career and acting indignant when we get upset about it.
Posted: Jul 29, 2006 7:07 am
 
VH is no fucking joke. And I'm mad at Rachel.
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 2:55 am
 
Damn , you nailed it scott. nicely done. That's the point I've been trying to get across too. And you are using us, Rachel. Don't say you come here to learn, when you act like you cannot ever be wrong, about anything. THe sheer pompousnes of your posts and your REFUSAL to admit the truth when its handed to you on a platter drives most of us batty. And writing personality profiles about people in bands is not the same thing as being a music writer.
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 7:27 pm
 
thanks for clarifying that for me...you really put me in my place!

wow.

you know you have really made an impact when people register new handles specifically to answer your comments. I think that's three now!

I might be a suck writer with terrible taste in music - but at least I'm not a giant pussy.

I don't know what's worse, starting a new handle to attack me, or emailing me privately APOLOGIZING or COMMISERATING about the assholes on this board. I have 6 of those.

you guys really need to take a valuim and stop taking whats posted on a stupid message board so seriously.

"Oh my god! You posted a list of mainstream artists on ths goner board to further your career? You used us!! OUTRAGEOUS!!!"

poor babies.

And Joel, I still love you.
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 9:08 pm
 
"Oh my god! You posted a list of mainstream artists on ths goner board to further your career? You used us!! OUTRAGEOUS!!!"

poor babies.


So you don't give a fuck that you go out of your way to annoy people WHILE using them?
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 10:33 pm | Edited by: mikesniper
 
I don't like to pick on people, but I think I know why people here are pissed. You're clearly not really an authority on this stuff, regardless of your credentials. Being defensive about it is silly. In a way, you've given everyone here a way to agree on something, your list is bad. When you read these kind of lists, you want to yell at the person who put it together, so thanks for that.

Here's some dumb shit you said:

About Patti Smith:
Who would have thought punk rock was, in part, kickstarted by a girl?
By reciting bad poetry over an overrated bar-band?

Dylan invented modern rock music.

Huh?

How the fuck would Tina Turner not exist without Aretha Franklin? and her 1967 album, no less!

This is what you say about Black Sabbath's 1st album..
Without this ... no Spinal Tap, no grunge or Kurt Cobain and, of course, no Osbournes.

It's great how you take one of the greatest debuts of all time, and, from a heaviness standpoint, came almost out of left field and all we would lose without it is a comedy movie and grunge.

Nevermind:
Without this ... no Seattle scene, no Britpop, no Pete Doherty.

I hear a lot of Nevermind in Blur's "Boys and Girls" for sure.

That's just a few things. The problem with your list is that there's no revelations. If you have even a passing interest in music, most of this stuff is familiar to you already. And you say NOTHING about any of these records that hasn't been said A MILLION times already in EVERY fucking magazine EVER.
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 10:51 pm
 
I'm defensive - - - - because I didn't write the list.

that's the only point I have been trying to make.

I was only curious as to the board's take on it would be - not anyone's opinion about me. MY BAD!!!

ok, done.
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 10:57 pm
 
I'm defensive - - - - because I didn't write the list.

Then why did you post such a boring list?
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 11:03 pm
 
done
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 11:03 pm
 
dun
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 11:03 pm
 
doon
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 11:06 pm
 
I know, let's all gang up on someone over something totally stupid.
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 11:29 pm
 
you guys really need to take a valuim and stop taking whats posted on a stupid message board so seriously.

Ahem...Do you have a mirror there sweetie?
Posted: Jul 30, 2006 11:41 pm
 
A lot more people go to CMJ every year than Gonerfest.

alot more people by shitty hamburgers made at McDonalds than the bar and grill down the street too. McDonalds must be way better then too?
Posted: Jul 31, 2006 12:26 am
 
which is worse? being a giant pussy or owning one?
I know! Let's make a list! Then I'll post it over at feminism.com and see how it goes over there.
Posted: May 12, 2007 9:38 pm
 
OK, whatever the hell a \\\"handle\\\" is (I only found this board because my fiance left it open last night), I think now I\\\'m guilty of creating one just for this argument, but I have to defend my kind. If Rachel is the voice of feminism, then I wanna be a guy.

Rachel, I do see some of your points. I\\\'m all for being open-minded, because you never know what you\\\'ll stumble on that you\\\'ll love, or at least you\\\'ll be more informed about the things you hate, and lots of people miss that. But I have to take issue with your comparison of eschewing the mainstream music world to pretending there is no government and thinking it will go away. You can acknowledge such things and yet choose to forego them. To quote Andy G. in No Requests Tonight: \\\"Do you people like rock and roll? No?? So what are you doing here - get the fuck out! You know, it\\\'s like, I hate opera, and you don\\\'t catch me hanging out down at the opera hall....\\\"

One more thing - Greg Cartwright, if you\\\'re out there, will you please play at my wedding on Oct. 12??!
Posted: May 12, 2007 10:02 pm
 
\\\RAPE!
Posted: May 13, 2007 3:14 am
 
i maybe really high on vicodin right now but it seems that rachel got a "B"in her rock n'roll history class
Posted: May 13, 2007 4:27 am
 

One more thing - Greg Cartwright, if you\\\'re out there, will you please play at my wedding on Oct. 12??!



if you were any kinda rocker you woulda asked Eric.
Posted: May 13, 2007 4:28 am
 
I only found this board because my fiance left it open last night),


wait a sec... you're an Oblivians fan and you're marrying an Oblivians fan and you didn't know about this board ubtil you found that he left it open last night? Something ain't right.
Posted: May 13, 2007 2:50 pm
 
I know, I know - forgive me. I wouldn't even know who the Oblivians were if it weren't for him, and he always has the computer - surfing sites like these for new music and finding new "List"s so he can lecture me about how wrong they are. Plus, I'm busy with my wedding-induced eating disorder relapse and working a second job to support his music habit. I suspect that's why more of your girlfriends aren't here, either. :)

Can Eric play some Sam Cooke? That's the only way we can get my parents to pay for it.

Ooh - I just saw my earlier post again, and the first part sounds pretty catty, so sorry about that. I was just irritated by her final comments. tkrichards said it already, though -

you guys really need to take a valuim and stop taking whats posted on a stupid message board so seriously.

Ahem...Do you have a mirror there sweetie?


It was an interesting debate until she got defensive. Obviously, she doesn't understand the Goner culture or the dynamics of this board, nor did she listen to Jack's explanation. These are good things to know when conducting good research for an article. If you're going to use a poll from the Weekly Standard, it's good to know that it's a right-wing magazine.
Posted: May 13, 2007 4:38 pm
 
Goner culture!!!!!!!!!
Posted: May 13, 2007 5:02 pm
 
working a second job to support his music habit.


DREAM GIRL!!!
Posted: May 13, 2007 9:39 pm
 
How did I miss this when it was originally posted? Damn, I would of had hours of fun with this!
My favorites include...without James Brown...we would be missing chunks of hip-hop. Thanks James. Thank You. Without Chic...there would be no Destiny's Child. Thanks Chic...Thank You. Without Kraftwerk...no techno or house. THANK YOU KRAFTWERK.

Sam Cooke/Ray Charles/Chuck Berry didn't change shit. All hail the Strokes!!!

This list was obviously made by high school kids or writers for "top" music magazines. Whoever made this list wouldn't know where to start if they were asked to make a list of records that influenced the list above. For example... The Rise and Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders From Mars would not exist without...?
Posted: May 13, 2007 11:55 pm
 
7 Patti Smith
Horses (1975)


Without this ... no REM, PJ Harvey, Razorlight.


thank god for patti smith!
Posted: May 14, 2007 12:06 am
 
Without this, there'd be no ... Bowie, Roxy Music, Siouxsie and the Banshees and the Jesus and Mary Chain, among many others.

Immediately and right off the bat, this list (and ones like it) is horseshit. I love that record too, but how presumptuous!!! Bowie was a freak at the same time that this record was released; recording that crazy shit for Deram. It is like saying, "There would be no Velvet Underground if Luis Bunuel had never made a movie." Sure music influences what comes next, but it doesn't CAUSE it.
Posted: May 14, 2007 4:38 pm
 
Hah, yes, it did feel very British.

I thought it was well-written, though, and chock full of excellent vocab. words. I don't agree with all of the cause and effect theories but whatever, good work!
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