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Goner Message Board / Memphis / The Ardent Records Story!
Posted: Mar 23, 2008 5:33 am
 
Alec Palao gave me a promo at the Sonics gig in London on Friday " AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!! A Big Star versh of I Got Kinda Lost, w/LX singing, is just one of the gems! Not to mention the legendary 'OK, produce that' demo of Downs!!!!

More info URL
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 5:53 am
 
No-one got any comments bout this? What gives?

There's also a Jesters album in the pipeline " 15 tracks from the Sun era!
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 6:44 am
 
Keg, nobody gives a damn about Big Star around here but carpetbaggers and furiners. They were the weeniest band ever. The Jesters? Who needs to promote that when Dickinson toots his own horn so much that it would be redundant for anybody else to do so (with the possible exception of Stutterin' Bob Gordon).
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 9:42 am
 
nobody gives a damn about Big Star

Except me...love 'em...a lot.
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 9:54 am
 
Ardent's the enemy!
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 5:05 pm
 
weeniest

i heard the Live at Overton Park CD and it weren't much. the drumming was very un-Memphian

un-Memphianistic?
un-Memphistic?
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 5:48 pm
 
Live they were horrible...or so I hear from the people that saw em...but I'll take those records anyday.

I've seen em twice since they regrouped...first time was fantastic...probably because I was SEEING these songs played for the first time....the last time at Beale st music fest...they just phoned it in.
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 6:13 pm
 
Alex seems like he's phoning it in every time (live), but I still love the records...
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 7:26 pm
 
Keg, nobody gives a damn about Big Star around here but carpetbaggers and furiners.

I stand corrected! But I'm with the Man City supporter on this, I love 'em, esp Alex's half-assedness and sense of humo(u)r...

You should hear the demo of Big Black Car, with the "Maybe we'll fuck at a Holiday Inn" line, mebbe you'd dig it...
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 7:46 pm
 
hey, cool! thanks for the heads up.
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 10:39 pm
 
i love em too.

just this week a customer of mine gave me a big star christmas poster. very cool. i had never seen it before.
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 10:50 pm
 
You should hear the demo of Big Black Car, with the "Maybe we'll fuck at a Holiday Inn" line, mebbe you'd dig it...


i'm not sure what it's on but i have it on a boot
Posted: Mar 25, 2008 11:07 pm
 
I saw Alex play solo at Knitting Factory years ago. The power went out so he sat on the bar with an acoustic and took requests . It was really great!
Posted: Mar 26, 2008 5:53 am | Edited by: BigKegShandy
 
just this week a customer of mine gave me a big star christmas poster.

Jim Cole gave me one of 'em, and it's up on the wall in our front room... makes me snigger ev'rytime I looks at it!
Posted: Mar 26, 2008 8:16 am
 
i reckon i'm a carpetbagger.
Posted: Mar 26, 2008 1:26 pm
 
Ardent's the enemy!

Gimmie a break. We just cut there to 2 " tape and had a fantastic time. The reigning sound did the same in November and also had a good time. Granted I'm a carpet bagger, but one doesn't have to hate Big Star or ardent to maintain street cred these days, does he?
Posted: Mar 26, 2008 1:37 pm
 
Ardent's the enemy!

Gimmie a break. We just cut there to 2 " tape and had a fantastic time. The reigning sound did the same in November and also had a good time. Granted I'm a carpet bagger, but one doesn't have to hate Big Star or ardent to maintain street cred these days, does he?


Jake, yer overreacting. I can picture the expression on LW's face as he says those words. Well, not that he ever "said" them per se, but you get what I'm sayin.

Love,

Fellow Carperbagger
Posted: Mar 26, 2008 1:42 pm
 
Fellow Carperbagger

CarpeTbagger, even.
I swear I could spell before I moved down here.
Posted: Mar 26, 2008 1:44 pm
 
I swear I could spell before I moved down here.


it's the city schools, they need some divine intervention, maybe herenton
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 1:30 am
 
one doesn't have to hate Big Star or ardent to maintain street cred these days, does he?

Yes.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 1:57 am
 
i love big star.

love,
yet another carpetbagger.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 9:57 am | Edited by: eric o
 
took a while, but i do love big star. kinda have a different attitude about it all after seeing LX over the years, kinda over the adulation / adoration.

rumple- was they weenier than the hot dogs? scruffs? whatever that jody stephens record was with the brothers on it? i no can believe it.

re: ardent- used to be fun to go master stuff with larry nix on the big vinyl lathe deal, and jody stephens still glows.

got i a bag of carpet on my own back.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 10:31 am
 
Jake, yer overreacting. I can picture the expression on LW's face as he says those words. Well, not that he ever "said" them per se, but you get what I'm sayin.

I'm sure it's all in good fun. I'm not waking up crying or anything.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 10:51 am
 
Eric...you're thinking of The Suspicions...Mike and Jimmy Enright.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 10:53 am
 
was they weenier than the hot dogs?
The Hot Dogs were kind of a fun bar band. They enjoyed playing. The two times I saw the three -piece Big Star(Bell was gone) ,nobody was smiling including the audience.The Hot Dogs were a fixture at the old Lafayettes Music Room in Overton Square. I never thought much of the Scruffs . The latter day Scruffs are strictly a vanity project of Stephen Burns . He is pumping his own money into that lifeless corpse of a band. Sorry Steph , it ain't gonna happen. The Suspicions was the Jody band in the early 80's - completely unmemorable and unremarkable. As far as Big Star is concerned , if Alex himself is not enamored of that material then how /why am I supposed to like it? I do love the Box Tops however.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 11:16 am
 
If I put out a record as great as #1 and it got rave reviews and then sold shit, I'd probably become a drunk and eat Seconals and Placidyl too.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 11:49 am
 
I love the term "carpetbaggers!" Used mainly by (relatives of &) people who dress up like Confederate soldiers & do those cool Civil War re-enactments. Onward, progress!

Bobby, tell me about your cool band from the '70s. LOL!

Last Scruffs show in town was amazing! Hope they play here again soon. Ultimate power pop. Somehow Stephen's still writing the best pop songs--pretty good for a guy 30-40 years past his teens! I'd also love to see another Chilton show at the Loose End!
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 12:30 pm
 
What is the expiration date on a carpetbagger? How long ya gotta live here before ya "go native"?

Btw, it took me awhile with Big Star as well, but the harmonies and guitar sounds finally did me in...
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 12:35 pm | Edited by: Golightly
 
guitar sounds finally did me in...

If you find a better recorded acoustic guitar, let me know.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 12:45 pm | Edited by: Rumpleforeskin
 
It's fine if y'all love BS. It's not worth arguing about. I had those LP's way back when but I gave them away to misguided Alex groupies. I just found BS boring and still do. They are not a fun band and Rock&Roll is supposed to be fun. I was one of the 20 people at their show at the High Cotton. Where were you? To me ,BS are just one of those bands that record geeks champion just so they can bond with others of their caste and make themselves feel elitist. Trust fund baies need trust fund baby bands as their heroes ,I guess. I dont even believe most of y'all really love them that much-it's just that you feel they are "required reading"- like hipsters and Yo Lo Tengo. The biggest BS fan I ever met was way into serial killers too. John Wayne Gacy was his idol. It could be worse -y'all could have the same taste as Chico Harris.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 1:05 pm
 
I do love the Box Tops however.
Now we're talking. I've seen Alex "live" in various incarnations, but possibly the best ever was a Box Tops show a few years back, in Buffalo - they showed up so late they might as well have canceled, yet played a full (killer) set to crowd of (mostly) Oldies fans. Alex sang his heart out, had more fun than anyone in the house, and then hung around signing autographs for every last straggler.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 1:06 pm
 
Used mainly by (relatives of &) people who dress up like Confederate soldiers & do those cool Civil War re-enactments. Onward, progress!
I was a Federal ,Shermie. Bobby, tell me about your cool band from the '70s. LOL! Got me there with your razor wit,Sherm. I was just going to see bands in the 70's -a lot of local ones too which ,believe it or not ,weren't exactly "amazing". Now tell me again about your halcyon days as the White Animals and Calculated X's number one fan.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 1:45 pm | Edited by: Bob Mehr
 
I’m sure I’ll regret opening this can o’ worms, being a full-on California-bred carpetbagger, and I don’t want to gang up on Rumpleforeskin, but….

First things first, I’ve been listening to the Ardent Story comp (and working on a piece about it) and anybody with anything more than a passing interest in Terry Manning/Big Star/Chris Bell/Alex Chilton will do himself a favor to pick it up when it comes out. It’s full of hard-to-find and out-of-print tunes, unreleased tracks and alternate versions of familiar things. The sound is killer and you get the best of all the pre-Big Star shit only available on bootlegs (Icewater demos, etc.) up until now. It’s got some chaff, certainly, but as an overview of the studio’s output and historical survey of the local scene in both the 60s and 70s, it’s pretty awesome.

Gotta say, reading all this Big Star hate - and it's not limited to the Goner board - is so utterly tiring and predictable. It basically runs on two tracks. The first is the classic case of a totally underrated band being rediscovered belatedly then mildly overrated (or at least name checked far too often by some pretty heinous people), thus yielding an inevitable backlash. That kind of shit is all about cred and trends anyway, and has nothing to do with the music, which is the only thing that hasn’t changed. Big Star records were great in ‘73, they were great when the CDs first came out in ’93 and they’re great now, no matter how the prevailing critical winds may be blowing.

Sonically, John Fry’s work on those three albums (especially the first two) are pure genius - the kind of thing that people will be listening to, deconstructing and aping for generations to come. They’re totally unassailable on that point. And frankly, in terms of the material, trying to compare charming but effectively second tier stuff like the Hot Dogs or Scruffs or anything similar to Big Star may be a cool contrarian notion in Memphis or on this board, but it’s an opinion totally fucking devoid of reality. I mean, I like Badfinger a lot, and I can come on a message board and say they were better than the Beatles, but that don’t make it so - or make me any less batty for saying it.

Second, as regards to Chilton, the hate seems to be personal. We all know dude is a remarkable and remarkably huge asshole in his own way (although, admit it, that’s part of what’s made his legend over the years). It’s a little closer to home for people in Memphis who’ve likely been personally burned/abused/belittled by the guy. Sucks for you, but that doesn’t retroactively make the Big Star records (or the Ork stuff, or Flyzon, or anything else he’s done) any less great. Frankly, the sound of Chilton passing wind in the studio - and I think I have a couple EPs of him from the '80s doing just that - would still be more interesting than half the rote, garage-by-numbers dreck that some people go apeshit over these days.

And whatever side you fall on in regards to his solo career, from a purely musical perspective Chilton is one of the most underrated guitarists, ever (“the John Coltrane of rhythm guitar” as Tom Waits put it - for whatever that’s worth). And his last covers album shows that the guy is totally amazing at what HE wants to be these days, which is a slop-brilliant interpretative singer/player. Plus, he killed the two times I saw him fronting the Box Tops for a bunch of 50 year-old female oldies fans who’d never even heard of Big Star.

As for the notion that “Alex himself is not enamored” of the Big Star material “then how/why am I supposed to like it?” Who gives a shit what Alex thinks - or rather, publicly states for his own twisted reasons, about his opinion re: Big Star. Is that how you decide what music you like? Got news for you: ask any iconic rock figure and they’re almost never prefer what everyone else thinks is their best work. Shit, Mick Jagger says he likes Bridges to Babylon over Exile; Dylan has named a half dozen records he likes better than Highway 61 or Blonde on Blonde; Neil Young probably will tell you Greendale is better than On the Beach or Zuma. So that argument doesn’t hold any water.

As for running down Big Star for being a lousy live band - again, totally irrelevant. Big Star were never intended to be a live band. They were a studio outfit. Fuck, they only ever played dozen or so gigs in their entire career (and with a different lineup every few gigs at that, so that was never the focus of what was a totally unusual and fractured performing career). And I’d even argue that they could’ve been a great live band if they wanted: the one gig that they actually geared up for somewhat at the Rock Writer’s convention in ’73 was so good that it knocked a roomful of hard ass cynics - Tosches, Meltzer, Bangs, etc. - for a loop and basically helped plant the seeds for their legend.

Ah, well, just my two cents…flame away.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 1:47 pm | Edited by: Vinyl Ritchie
 
Shit, if it wasnt for Big Star 3rd...Jim Dickinson wouldnt have anything decent with his name on it...
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 1:55 pm
 
White Animals! Now you're talking fun band: great rockin' songs/covers, high energy live show, tons of hot new wave & sorority chicks getting drunk & crazy on x. What's not to like?????? Good times! And I'll throw the Crime in there too since they were almost as fun & more rockin' than the White Animals.

Calculated X, not so much. Never was a big fan of theirs, But they did bring in tons of hot new wave chicks in the best Chelsea Ltd. fashions of the time.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 2:12 pm
 
Bob, I know this sounds like damning with faint praise, but your repsonse is one of the most well-reasoned things I've ever read in this forum.

And this is from someone who has dug those records for a long time but overplayed them so much years ago that he doesn't often listen to them willingly.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 2:16 pm
 
Boy...I was hoping to get out of this one unscathed. I loved Big Star the first time I heard #1...even through the incessant heckling my band received from Alex and his court...it would have been easy to say he's a jerk and I hate his stuff...but I would be betraying my ears which I'm quite attached to.

To quote another person probably deemed uncool around these parts "I never travel far, without a little Big Star".

One of my top five bands and I ain't ashamed...if you got any Big Star lps you don't want, I'll take 'em.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 2:31 pm
 
I was one of the 20 people at their show at the High Cotton. Where were you?
in diapers, cotton diapers to be precise.
I got into Big Star via the Replacements, nothing wrong with that.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 3:03 pm
 
I don't "hate" Big Star -I just don't love them. Complete apathy is more accurate. I just don't find any joy in those records. I do own one BS CD these days-"Nobody Can Dance". I was at that Shell show and I can hear myself yell out a request for "The Letter" (which was fulfilled but not exactly the greatest version ever). As far as Alex is concerned , I'm not a hater-"Flies On Sherbet" is a complete howl. I think it is the greatest comedic R&R album ever. People who hate that record ( and there are legions) just ain't in on the joke.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 3:21 pm
 
Rump, baby! No "joy" in something like "O My Soul"? C'mon, now, you can actually hear them giddy with laughter on that track. Oh well, to each his own. You are entitled to your opinion, sir. And the fact that you get Flies redeems you in my opinion forever.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 3:27 pm | Edited by: Rumpleforeskin
 
Who wants to bid on my promo 45 copy of "O My Soul" given to me by Big Al himself? Never played.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 3:31 pm
 
Who wants to bid on my promo 45 copy of "O My Soul" given to me by Big Al himself? Never played.

Have you looked at it?
If so...I'll pass...I'm trying to find one that no one has even looked at.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 3:32 pm
 
I don't hate Big Star but I'm not crazy about them. I think the hype came from the guys making underground Byrds records in the southeast and not the northwest. Not so much lyrically. I always heard a Notorious Byrd Brothers or Untitled era of the Byrds in Big Star. Minus the country feel. I had to laugh the day I noticed Chilton holding that Byrds album on the cover of 1970. That's Chilton's best work imo. Call me lame but I'd be more likely to put on the 1st side of the Hot Dogs LP than any BS record. It took a long time for me to feel that way also. The production on the HD's album destroys any work on all 3 BS records. Bottom line is...Terry Manning was Ardent. Not saying the place wouldn't exist without him, but Ardent is known world wide for his work in the studio alone. He always seems to be the last one to get mentioned when people talk about the place. This thread is a good example. Leave it to Bob to be the first to mention Terry. Overall, the story of Ardent is amazing. Still, my favorite Ardent records were recorded in John Fry's grandma's sewing room.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 3:40 pm
 
I noticed Chilton holding that Byrds album on the cover of 1970. That's Chilton's best work imo.

That version of "Sugar Sugar" is very near and dear to my heart.

Terry Manning was Ardent. Not saying the place wouldn't exist without him, but Ardent is known world wide for his work in the studio alone.

No question he was crucial. I think I posted the link before, but his question/answer forum on prosoundweb.com makes for some enlightening and enjoyable reading.

http://recforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/f/40/0/
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 3:49 pm
 
That version of "Sugar Sugar" is very near and dear to my heart.
Mr. Manning strikes again!!!

No question he was crucial. I think I posted the link before, but his question/answer forum on prosoundweb.com makes for some enlightening and enjoyable reading.
Thanks for posting that again. I love reading that. He really drops a lot of production knowledge buried in all those Led Zeppelin questions.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 3:59 pm
 
that 1970 album is great! why no in print? ardent? hello?
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:02 pm | Edited by: Rumpleforeskin
 
How rare $$ is that Terry Manning LP (orig.Enterprise issue)? I have that somewhere. Believe it or not ,that album got a good bit of airplay on FM100 .
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:02 pm | Edited by: bradx
 
i think the first big star album was one of the best produced records ever. the songwriting is perfect, just the right mix of complicated but not too complicated. i wasnt even born when they broke up, and heard them simply because of that 70s show theme song, but when i heard their first album the first time i knew it was one of those things i would be listening to a million times, for the rest of my life. i could care less what they sounded like live, but i do have several bootlegs with great version of their songs, mostly solo alex or with the new members. far from trying to be cool for liking them, my friends cant stand them for the most part. i even think the new big star lp is good and own it on vinyl.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:03 pm
 
The Scorpio dude was at shangri this past weeked and was asking what LP reissues he should do. 1970 and Home Sweet Home were at the top of my list.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:10 pm
 
Agreed, Buck, the Big Star resurgence in America was largely the child of the db's guys, Stamey and Holsapple, and their enthusiam and them passing along the tapes and tales of the band to R.E.M., the Replacements, etc. I think they were kinda cheifly responsible for really making the Ryko CD reissues viable too.

And Manning is ridiculously underrated as a performer/producer and concept guy -- although, if he doesn't get the credit for the success and sound of Ardent, it's his own doing. Dude is pretty elusive living in the Bahamas or whatever. But the stuff on 1970, Home Sweet Home (and by extension the idea behind Flies -- good or bad) are as much Manning's creation as Chilton's. He does get an amazing sound on all those records and you can't deny the guy knew his way around the studio -- don't forget all the Stax stuff as well, his work with Led Zep, and on and on. (Speaking of underrated guys, Joe Hardy is another Ardent alum who had a hand in some great records, who you never hear mentioned. Hampton is pretty amazing as well: the mixes he did for country acts in the early 90s -- awful shit like Travis Tritt and Little Texas -- SOUNDED killer coming out of the radio).

Anyway, I definitely disagree that the Hot Dogs album is superior on any level to the Big Star catalog (certainly not the tunes, and I think it may be a case of apples and oranges from a production perspective as well -- depends what your taste is though, I guess).

But, the stories you hear about Fry and his pure technical expertise and instinctive and intuitive sonic sense are actually kinda freaky. All those guys, Manning included, were students of Fry in a way.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:13 pm
 
The hype came from great reviews & press created by the Rock Writers' Convention coupled with no distribution from Stax. People wanted but could not get=demand.

I haven't gotten out my stethoscope to listen to the production on the Hot Dogs, but the Big Star songs are far stronger. Hot Dogs were good; Big Star were great. Can we all agree that there were great engineer(s) & songwriters & musicians at Ardent circa '69-'74??? It's not just one guy or one musician; the environment created by John Fry brought all those folks around, and as much as I love Terry Manning & his solo record, he didn't write the best songs Ardent put out (nor perform them).
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:29 pm | Edited by: Rumpleforeskin
 
People wanted but could not get=demand.
I only saw #1 Record and Radio City in one record store in Memphis. That was in Disc Records in the Southland Mall. Stax didn't even half try to get it into the stores in it's own town! I don't think there were more than a handful of dedicated record stores here at that time including the two Pop Tunes and Popeye's. Forget about the records getting into Sears or Goldsmith's record dept.s.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:31 pm | Edited by: Bob Mehr
 
Whoa. Has this thread actually been a lively, healthy debate? An exchange of genuine thoughts, ideas and opinions? This needs to be stopped right now, and turned into a bizarre and juvenile name calling session. Ned, sir, will you do the honors? Please tell us how Chilton is a fag, and how if he was just coming out today he'd be signed to Matador.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:54 pm
 
drag city, definitely.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 4:56 pm
 
I hear ya guys. Just don't understand why Manning goes under the radar and Dickinson flys so high. Half, if not less the talent if you ask me. There was an obvious change in engineering once Terry showed up.Who cares anyway? Ardent was/is great. And it did take everyone there to make it what it is. Just think certain folks could get mentioned a little more. If they are a little to modest to do it themselves, then their co-workers should do it for them. The 30 years of Ardent article in the flyer a few years back was great. I remember about 3 sentences that mentioned Terry. I'm just a little confused I guess.

I definitely disagree that the Hot Dogs album is superior on any level to the Big Star catalog
Never said anything was superior. Said "I" would be more likely to put on the Hot Dogs than Big Star.

he didn't write the best songs Ardent put out (nor perform them).
He didn't write much of anything. Never said he was an amazing musician, even though he is.

don't forget all the Stax stuff as well
"Walk On By" might be one of the best produced/recorded songs of all time.

Sherm, I still laugh about you saying BS was the 1st power pop band. BS indeed brotha!
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 5:03 pm
 
I hear ya guys. Just don't understand why Manning goes under the radar and Dickinson flys so high. Half, if not less the talent if you ask me.

seems to me that Manning sort of shuns any attention. Not in any curmudgeonly way... just like, not that interested. Dickinson, not so much.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 5:25 pm
 
Ned, sir, will you do the honors?
Shhh, don't mention his name. Notice he hasn't posted in almost 3 weeks?
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 5:35 pm
 
One of the first...don't recall being so definitive...certainly 1st I ever heard around here...& today none come to mind I would say were before them in that category. Maybe the Kinks, but what I heard from them on the radio growing up around here certainly wasn't power pop. Hardly b.s., but if you think so, it is so, bro-main!
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 5:46 pm
 
Just off the top of my head, I would consider the Nazz to be more of a power pop band than Big Star. They broke up before BS even formed. There were plenty of late 60's bands I would consider power pop over BS. Don't remember you saying "around hear" either. If you did, I would have agreed.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 5:54 pm
 
One of the first
I'm comfortable with that. I think of 'Power Pop' as the product of fans of the First Generation (ie. Kinks, Zombies, Beach Boys et al)
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 6:00 pm
 
Ok, you win! Record collecting hairs split infinitely. I've got a b-ball tournament to watch & you care far more about it than I do. I'll take Big Star's whole catalog over any band known as power pop--including (according to Wikipedia!) the Who, the Beach Boys, the Nazz, Badfinger, Cheap Trick, & even the Hot Dogs!

P.S. The Nazz played from '67-'69 during the years the Box Tops were touring with the Beach Boys so a lot of this stuff was happening concurrently.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 6:01 pm
 
Nazz, yup sure. Raspberries. And gotta give props to Montreal's Michel Pagliaro (1971 saw the release of his first English language record, partially cut at Abbey Road)
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 6:03 pm
 
One of the first
I'm comfortable with that. I think of 'Power Pop' as the product of fans of the First Generation (ie. Kinks, Zombies, Beach Boys et al)


Then you have to consider not only Todd Rundgren AKA Turd Runtgreen and the Nazz, but also Eric Carmen (pre-Raspberries even, cf. Cyrus Erie, "Get the Message," 1969) and - yes - Badfinger before Big Star. Not that it matters all that much, each had their moments.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 6:32 pm
 
Always check with Wikipedia.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 6:35 pm
 
i am just waitin for Jim to put his 2 cents in. i love how often i can pick up some random publication and read his letters to the editors.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 6:42 pm
 
raspberries are one of my favorite bands, they and badfinger wrote perfect songs, in the same way big star did. theres plenty of stuff more rocking or more complicated, but all 3 of those bands had their moments of absolute perfection.
Posted: Mar 27, 2008 8:10 pm
 
Tbagger, even.
Gross! Sorry - I know this is a semi-serious thread. Carry on.
Posted: Mar 28, 2008 12:52 pm
 
"re: ardent- used to be fun to go master stuff with larry nix on the big vinyl lathe deal"

--Just an update for all you haters who just recently graduated to DAT decks: that very combination of man and device will be slicing grooves in fresh lacquer real soon.
Posted: Mar 28, 2008 3:39 pm
 
signed to Matador

c'mon, the label would not exist except for Big Star. but who cares?

First heard BS as "have you heard Alex Chilton's stuff after Box Tops"? Sure was a head fuck but eventually I grew to appreciate it. I really think it was just so out-of-left-field and that's why opinions diverge. But some of those songs were beautiful (still are). and a testament to Ardent skills.

I sure wouldn't describe Big Star as power pop. Too much "english folk sound" (for want of a better phrase) in there.

I always thought the Box Tops were Chilton and a back-up band, is the "touring oldies" act the same guys?
I love turning down the one channel on the album and just getting Chilton's vocal and the weird sound effects/horn parts
Posted: Mar 28, 2008 5:36 pm
 
I always thought the Box Tops were Chilton and a back-up band

That's probably accurate as far as the recordings go, but they were a real live band that toured. The reunited Box Tops I've seen included originals Bill Cunningham and Gary Talley and probably drummer Danny Smythe
Posted: Mar 28, 2008 6:10 pm
 
Other way around...high school talent show singer Chilton was plucked to sing with Ronnie & the Devilles at American Recording sans Ronnie Jordan thus becoming Box Tops.

Original Box Top John Evans also has been touring with 'em. They've been mostly the original guys for about the last 10 years. Always seem to hit the Milwaukee summer festival circuit thing.
Posted: Mar 29, 2008 5:27 am
 
former drummer and tour manager thomas boggs is battling cancer pretty hard. love the liner note that calls him the hardest working box top. got some stories on that guy myself that are pretty funny. hit me up when i'm drunk. it's worth it. until i talk about something else that is.
Posted: Mar 29, 2008 5:27 am
 
thirteen and ballad of el goodo are the only slow songs i listen to anymore its seems.
Posted: Mar 29, 2008 7:05 pm | Edited by: BigKegShandy
 
Big can, big worms, Big Star!

I love BS, and all'a the bullshit that goes with it, before and after it... from The Letter to Loose Shoes, LX has produced some absolute, dissolute, carefully-planned, off the cuff shit that ranks up there with the best. LX joined the BS club, not the other way around, and has his own erratic, most enjoyable path, producing much more great r'n'r gristle than most 'power pop' yea-or-nea-sayers would thunk! The 'feeling heavy metal' bit of Sugar Sugar, the cracked versh of Surfer Girl on Beale St Green or his take on Volare is just as much LX to me as September Gurls, Thirteen or Take Me Home And Make Me Like It...

How odd that BS have engendered such a fractured fanbase! Cripes, there's the 'I don't like the third album' mob, or those (like me) who find Chris Bell's religious bent (no pun intended!) a bit much, on stuff such as There Was A Light or, why not, My Life Is Right... and hating BS for seeing/hearing REM talk about their passion (pun intended) is just stoooopid. Can't blame Dickinson for running his mouth more often than Terry Manning �" Jim's got an ego, so did fucking Ghandi, so what? He's a great raconteur, regardless...

I didn't listen to In Space, tho'...
Posted: Mar 29, 2008 8:16 pm
 
Chris Bell's Look Up will be played at my funeral....MANY years from now.
Posted: Mar 30, 2008 4:42 am
 
I\'d also love to see another Chilton show at the Loose End!

Ahh, the good old days! I recall seeing quite a few good shows at the Loose End and not just the ones I put together for Pop Culture Press.

go tigers!

P.S. How come I always smell patchouli when I hear someone mention the White Animals?
Posted: Mar 30, 2008 3:02 pm
 
...the Big Star resurgence in America was largely the child of the db's guys, Stamey and Holsapple, and their enthusiam and them passing along the tapes and tales of the band to R.E.M., the Replacements, etc.

Ted Barron just posted a fine piece of Big Star reminiscing by Will Rigby on his Boogie Woogie Flu blog - worth a read.
Posted: Apr 2, 2008 9:35 pm
 
Hey Sherman, you called Rumpel "Bobby". I thought it was him all along. Thanks for confirming it!! Yeh, what was his band?LOL
Posted: Apr 3, 2008 3:08 pm
 
whats up with that turd of a "documentary" on Ardent that they show on the Library Channel?

They show about 5 seconds of Big Star footage with Chris Bell and then it goes into minutes upon minutes of ZZ Top 80s videos and it has amazing insights like "oooo...wow..."Eliminator" was recorded there! " Hunka shit.
Posted: Apr 3, 2008 3:51 pm
 
but you gotta admit zz can be fun live! i love them both, but 5 seconds of big star? wtf? They played Thieteen on "How I met your mother" sitcom last week!
Posted: Apr 3, 2008 3:52 pm
 
oops Thirteen
Posted: Apr 4, 2008 7:13 am
 
I like the first two records a lot. But that compressed, out-of-phase Strat sound drives me nuts.

GUITAR NERD ALERT!!! GUITAR NERD ALERT!!!
Posted: Apr 4, 2008 8:24 am
 
Oh, and by the way...I don't really think of Jake, Jeremy, & Bob as being "carpetbaggers". To me, you guys are more like rakes, rounders, cads, and ne'er-do-wells.
Posted: Apr 5, 2008 9:30 am
 
*more guitar nerding*

Man JP, I'm as Strat weary as the next guy, but I love the sound on "Oh! My Soul" Especially when he changes to the neck pickup on the second lick of the solo. They say he was playing through the HIWATT what still is there at Ardent.
Posted: Apr 5, 2008 10:30 am
 
Oh, and by the way...I don't really think of Jake, Jeremy, & Bob as being "carpetbaggers". To me, you guys are more like rakes, rounders, cads, and ne'er-do-wells.

I prefer to be referred to as scallywag. Let's not forget about the fact that Big Star are the band most often associated with reconstruction.
Posted: Apr 5, 2008 11:41 am
 
Let\'s not forget about the fact that Big Star are the band most often associated with reconstruction.

Isn\'t that a Chilton album from the 90\'s? A Man Called Reconstruction?

They say he was playing through the HIWAT

That was his second mistake!
Posted: Apr 5, 2008 12:20 pm
 
I thought that amp was a Ampeg...either a Gemini VI or a Reverberocket
Posted: Apr 6, 2008 10:33 am
 
Ampeg is on 3rd.

HIWATTS rule!
Posted: May 2, 2008 4:18 pm
 
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